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Microsoft Edge and open source collaboration

blogs.windows.com

101–110 of 304 posts

Re: Microsoft Edge and open source collaboration

#101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is step 2: Extend.

Oh enough of this meme, please. It should be required that anyone who tries to be clever with it actually justify it with a full explanation on what they think the three matching steps are/will be.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary justification.

EEE, astroturfing and similar bait and switch tactics has been so common for decades that some companies are guilty until proven innocent.

Re: Microsoft Edge and open source collaboration

#102

Man, this sucks. I really wish they had open sourced their new engine and stuck with it. I would have volunteered time porting it to Linux/POSIX as well.

This is probably going to get a bit "rant-ey", it's not directed at you, but at the ecosystem at large (and kind of at myself). Everyone keeps saying this, but nobody is actually doing anything about it. People (myself included) talk about how a monoculture is bad, but we still don't use Edge. We talk about how more competition in the browser space is a good thing, but we still complain when the latest features or se…

> (i'm used to chrome, my information is in chrome, I'm used to the dev tools in chrome, and I personally and selfishly have no reason to switch to Edge, even if it's technically better)

Yep, the same can be said for Firefox. There are hundreds of threads with hundreds of comments on places like Hacker News and Reddit and Ars Technica, all grousing about how Google is the behemoth that is taking over, Chrome is bloated and slowing down and e-mails all of your personal bits to Google, oh woe shouldn't there be a equal competitor in the market, blah, blah...

But too few people actually put their clicking where their talking is and switch to any other browser. People seem hardwired to say "yeah I know it sucks but I want to use Google and thus I want to use Chrome."

Far fewer people with software development skills--that I sorely lack--bother to contribute to Firefox (or, heaven forbid, Thunderbird) development to fix those problems.

Meanwhile, I hug Firefox just a little bit closer every year, wondering if this year is the year that the project fails or simply stops moving forward or whatever. I'm thrilled that companies like Privacy, Krypt.co, and even Capital One still make Firefox extensions and I use them daily. But for how long, when every technology-oriented person on the planet seems hell-bent on using Chrome, outcomes be damned?

Re: Microsoft Edge and open source collaboration

#103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm assuming I'm not the only one who's afraid of Blink becoming the new Internet Explorer; instead of people following a web standard, they'll follow what's Chrome-compatible. This is already the norm. I use Safari and find many sites have issues. Before that I used Firefox and many sites had issues. Typically the JS works, but styling often looks different (and worse) on Safari and Firefox.

Do you have examples? I use Safari and don’t find this to be true. Given Safari is what people use in iOS, id expect this to be rarely the case (most sites will test on an iPhone).

Cant come up with example but i have fixed quite a few safari issues as a web dev. Often they dont appear on iphones because the media queries for mobile are tested on iphones, but desktop layouts are tested on chrome. Safari had a few flexbox quirks that caught me out most recently.

Re: Microsoft Edge and open source collaboration

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Edge was only available to Windows users. And still, it was some competition to Chrome and Firefox. > encourage everyone to use Firefox. Which can be done while also lamenting the loss of a Firefox competitor, especially when said loss gains Firefox nothing.

MS could have chosen to base their platform on Firefox, but they chose to go with Chromium. We can lament the passing of Edge, but I wonder how people would have felt if instead of Edge they just had this announcement as the replacement for IE. Would we have cared? No one seems to miss IE.

> MS could have chosen to base their platform on Firefox...

There actually might have been an outcry over this. I'm not aware of any Firefox forks, for example, that aren't focused on privacy. MS would have been the first to fork FF and undo lots of the privacy features in the browser (engine).

With Chrome/Chromium, there's a reluctant acceptance of data-harvesting and (unethical) tracking.

I wonder if MS gave the above scenario some thought...

Re: Microsoft Edge and open source collaboration

#105

A lot of you guys are lamenting this decision. I'm insanely excited about it! I've been working on a new reader and documentation manager for PDF and cached web content: https://getpolarized.io/ It's based on Electron and targets Chromium. What I'm hoping happens here is that this means more focus on Chromium and potentially more work on Electron + Carlo. Electron is amazing but it's pretty bloated per app. If it's m…

The fact that projects choose to target a specific rendering engine as opposed to just writing web standards compliant code and having it work in any browser that follows those standards is precisely the reason why people (me, at least) are lamenting this decision.

With Edge, Blink, and Webkit competing for marketshare, app developers are forced to at least think about sticking to web standards or risk losing a chunk of potential users. In a world where only Blink exists and all developers care about is that things work in Blink, any new browser entering the market now not only has to worry about compliance with official web standards, they also need to worry about emulating the idiosyncratic behavior of Blink that developers have discovered and started abusing or taking advantage of. The actual standards essentially become moot and Blink becomes the real standard. And while, sure, Blink/Chromium is open source, with both Google and Microsoft heavily invested in its development and direction, who do you think is going to have all the power in making the important decisions?

Re: Microsoft Edge and open source collaboration

#106

If Microsoft knew that Edge in its current state is inferior, why did they try so hard to make every windows user switch to it? I mean there was this "startup growth hacking" kind of craziness from a corporation and sudden admittance of defeat... It's very confusing. Edit: We all know why they want everyone to switch don't we, but think about all the now admittedly false marketing! It's not like they stopped the aggr…

I don't think this is an admission that Edge's engine was inferior, just that it might be easier to convince people to use Edge if it used the same engine as Chrome. Using Chromium is just one less reason to not use Edge.

I mean if Microsoft can somehow shed the "Windows 10 spies on me" sentiment echoed so much around these parts then they might be able to capture some market share from Google who is more and more being perceived as big brother spying on you.

I doubt this move will help them but it will definitely make the justification for Enterprise adoption of Chrome a little harder.

Re: Microsoft Edge and open source collaboration

#109
Recipe for success: Take chromium and make it super private. Put a moat up for identity, add a VPN (if that makes some people feel better), encrypt traffic etc.

You could even charge people for the heavy duty version that might use some Azure services. The only issue with this is charging people requires tying their browser to the payment method.

Re: Microsoft Edge and open source collaboration

#110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh enough of this meme, please. It should be required that anyone who tries to be clever with it actually justify it with a full explanation on what they think the three matching steps are/will be.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary justification. EEE, astroturfing and similar bait and switch tactics has been so common for decades that some companies are guilty until proven innocent.

I disagree that EEE has been "so common for decades". It's a tactic Microsoft employed for some time and, as far as I can see, hasn't used since (not as a common strategy at the very least).

The only company I can think of that EEE-as-a-strategy might apply to is AWS, and I say this with huge reservations because their priority is still their customers.

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