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Measuring the “Filter Bubble”: How Google is influencing what you click

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11–20 of 131 posts

Re: Measuring the “Filter Bubble”: How Google is influencing what you click

#11

Google can and should customize search results based on location, and it's not just about "local articles" as the article suggests. If enough people from the same general location click on certain results more frequently, then those results should rank higher for others who search from that same general location. We use Google because the results are useful, not because they are "unbiased". Ranking implies some sort…

> I think people will switch back to Google because they find the results more useful, even in privacy mode.

I now use duckduckgo as default search engine and my experience is mixed.

The problem with google is that sometime you search for something new and then you see the bubble very clearly, which applies non only to search but also to youtube (maybe even more).

The problem with duckduckgo is that you are searching for something specific or something you saw months ago and don't remember well then google's index and tracking can be useful.

Re: Measuring the “Filter Bubble”: How Google is influencing what you click

#12
post #10

Google can and should customize search results based on location, and it's not just about "local articles" as the article suggests. If enough people from the same general location click on certain results more frequently, then those results should rank higher for others who search from that same general location. We use Google because the results are useful, not because they are "unbiased". Ranking implies some sort…

What you're saying makes sense for location dependent results (e.g. searching a map of nearby places). For something like "origin of the universe" results would be very different across the world. What happens when I'm in a location I'm not usually in? Do I get the local results or the results for the place I usually reside?

But their searches were (at least partially) political in nature, so a result of a national news site talking of a local news would be relevant. "gun control" is location dependent is there is a protest at your city

Re: Measuring the “Filter Bubble”: How Google is influencing what you click

#13
I have mixed thoughts about Google's change. (Often it gives you what you might want rather than what you searched for). I think I summarized my thoughts well here (which I'll just quote again below to save you a click): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17423373#17430763

>Normally I only use Google, but I've also experienced this. In contrast with a few years ago, more recently Google gave me such bullshit that I was like, "Just give me the pages that have these keywords, this is so obvious" and I went to duckduckgo.com. There, with literally the exact same query, every one of the top links was relevant and had my search terms. On Google none of the first page of links had what I searched for. This certainly supports "they show me what they want me to see", rather than what I asked for.

>On the flip side, I still find Google useful and I must say that I often am happy to read what they decide to give me: even if it's not what I searched for.

On the whole I guess I support Google's changes, they serve me well. But one thing, though, is that the old algorithms which are deprecated are probably literally less than 5 minutes from a production deploy - so I wonder what Google would have to lose by keeping the old, well-working algorithms in some kind of classic deprecated search. Everyone on it is still eyeballs for their ads, so if it really doesn't take any extra resources to keep the classic view up somewhere (besides a few minutes for someone to deploy it), then why not expose it as long as it works well. (Obviously the classic algorithms might stop working if spam against those algorithms becomes insurmountable, I realize it's a bit of a cat and mouse game between SEO and Google's algorithms. On the other hand since hardly anyone would use the classic interface, spammers might stop doing SEO against it and ignore it entirely.) So if those algorithms are really a few clicks away, perhaps it would be a good thing for them to deploy just for the people are are about to go to duckduckgo or bing because Google just isn't giving them what they're searching for.

Thoughts?

Re: Measuring the “Filter Bubble”: How Google is influencing what you click

#14

To make this research more interesting I'd like to see: 1) repeated queries from the same user. Do the results stay constant over time or do they change? 2) comparisons to the same experiment run against e.g. Bing or DuckDuckGo. It seems to me that some variation in results is to be expected because of users hitting different backends which might be at different stages of index rollouts. Similarly, response times of…

> Lastly, the insinuation of the article is that "unbiased" search results are clearly preferable.

the insinuation is that you should know if they are biased or that you should be able to get unbiased result if you so wish.

It also raises suspicions on how much google tracks each user.

From this point of view what would be interesting would be a local study, to see in 100 people all in the same neighbourhood with different browsing habits have different results. this would eliminate the "non-tracking" part of the personalization.

Re: Measuring the “Filter Bubble”: How Google is influencing what you click

#15

Google can and should customize search results based on location, and it's not just about "local articles" as the article suggests. If enough people from the same general location click on certain results more frequently, then those results should rank higher for others who search from that same general location. We use Google because the results are useful, not because they are "unbiased". Ranking implies some sort…

The point of the article was that, even when there is no reason to do so because location and identity are identical, Google STILL gives differently ranked results. Please read more carefully.

And I've been using DDG for a bit now and have found it perfectly useable.

Re: Measuring the “Filter Bubble”: How Google is influencing what you click

#16
This is a really cool application of research to describe something difficult to grok for the average user (myself included) but which really highlights the benefit of using an anonymized search engine with static results. It's like saying, "There's room for us both." But with real metrics and data.

Re: Measuring the “Filter Bubble”: How Google is influencing what you click

#17

To make this research more interesting I'd like to see: 1) repeated queries from the same user. Do the results stay constant over time or do they change? 2) comparisons to the same experiment run against e.g. Bing or DuckDuckGo. It seems to me that some variation in results is to be expected because of users hitting different backends which might be at different stages of index rollouts. Similarly, response times of…

> Lastly, the insinuation of the article is that "unbiased" search results are clearly preferable. I'm not convinced. I for one like that STD for me is associated with the C++ standard namespace (which I search for all the time) rather than sexually transmitted diseases (which I luckily don't have to care about as much).

On the other hand, authors could find better names for their libraries ...

Further, there are different solutions, where the user has full control over the context of their search. For instance by maintaining a fully user-controlled list of keywords that is remembered by a cookie (which can be deleted as well).

Re: Measuring the “Filter Bubble”: How Google is influencing what you click

#18
2018 was the year I adopted ddg, not because of privacy, but because google result sucks.

Almost every time I search, I don’t get a single result I want on the first page. The first 3 results are sponsored adds, then there is the Danish Wikipedia article (useless), then 3-6 advertisements pretending to be content, and then if I’m lucky something that was relevant 5 years ago.

DDG isn’t much better, but it’s better.

I’m not sure if search engines are really to blame though. With everyone being on Facebook, Medium, Quora, reddit, 4chan and so on, it’s like the web just stopped having content worth visiting.

If it wasn’t because HN gave me interesting content, I’m honestly not sure why I’d ever browse the internet anymore. But maybe I’m just getting grumpy.

Re: Measuring the “Filter Bubble”: How Google is influencing what you click

#20
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you're saying makes sense for location dependent results (e.g. searching a map of nearby places). For something like "origin of the universe" results would be very different across the world. What happens when I'm in a location I'm not usually in? Do I get the local results or the results for the place I usually reside?

But their searches were (at least partially) political in nature, so a result of a national news site talking of a local news would be relevant. "gun control" is location dependent is there is a protest at your city

I guess it comes down to what a search engine should assume your reason for searching is based on what you enter. If the query doesn't strongly imply I'm looking for "news about X"; "local opinion on X"; or "closest place related to X", I'd like it to assume I'm doing "research on X" so I get results that do not take my arbitrary location into account.
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