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Why Do Hospitals Hate Sleep So Much?

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Re: Why Do Hospitals Hate Sleep So Much?

#131

Post by tempestn »

CodeAndCuffs wrote: post #30

For both of our children, the hospital caused us more stress and discomfort than anything else. Newborn baby's finally asleep, wife is comfortable re pain, finally start to get some sleep. Then the nurse comes in at 2 am, writes her name on the board, asks us questions that they should have the answer to, then leaves. Nurse change 3x a day, baby doctor checking in to ask if were ok, mom doctor doing the same, house k…

Similar experience here except the meal people were 9x a day, not 3. They would come in to take an order (as I recall there were generally two options) 30-60 minutes before the meal was delivered, and then again some time afterward to clean it up. Which I feel like I shouldn't complain about, since they're providing you with food (although only for the patient, not the poor, sleep deprived dad...) But man was it annoying when you were just trying to get a few minutes of sleep!

Re: Why Do Hospitals Hate Sleep So Much?

#132

Post by benj111 »

missingcolours wrote: post #115
CodeAndCuffs wrote: post #30

For both of our children, the hospital caused us more stress and discomfort than anything else. Newborn baby's finally asleep, wife is comfortable re pain, finally start to get some sleep. Then the nurse comes in at 2 am, writes her name on the board, asks us questions that they should have the answer to, then leaves. Nurse change 3x a day, baby doctor checking in to ask if were ok, mom doctor doing the same, house k…

A key lesson I learned with our first child was "just about everything gets easier once you leave the hospital", so with our second we prioritized GTFOing ASAP. It was a good decision.

Yes. Having a different person coming in every 5 minutes to check something else.

Somewhat tempered by having to go back in a week later, so all these things aren't useless. Child birth isn't the risk free thing we like to think it is.

Re: Why Do Hospitals Hate Sleep So Much?

#134

Post by jon-wood »

andai wrote: post #100
dingaling wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly that reflects Airbus vs Boeing cockpit philosophies. In the early 1980s Airbus adopted Dark Cockpit where the default state of all annunciator lights is off. If one illuminates then it indicates something worthy of attention. The colour of illumination indicates functional state; blue is good, amber is malfunctional.

When would something illuminated blue? When it's both working smoothly and worthy of attention?

I assume that's for indicators of abnormal, but safe, state. One example could be the undercarriage being down, a situation that would usually not be expected, but when you're in the process of landing doesn't warrant attracting your attention as an error state.

Re: Why Do Hospitals Hate Sleep So Much?

#135

Post by hvidgaard »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #106
cperciva wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tangentional, but why recent head trauma shouldn't be allowed to sleep? This was dead, but it seems like a sensible question so I vouched for the comment to resurrect it. My understanding is that with any head trauma doctors are concerned about the possibility of bleeding into the brain, and it's much easier to detect the neurological symptoms of this in a patient who is awake. But I'm not a medical doctor; someone e…

My mother is a doctor (in a different specialty), and this came up when we watched 10 Things I Hate About You , which repeats the myth. You're correct; as far as the patient is concerned, it's better for them if you let them sleep. But it's easier for everyone else if the patient isn't allowed to sleep, as sleeping and dying look exactly the same.

My son managed to get himself a concussion in kindergarden once. Our doctor told us that as long as he's able answer questions normally and focus on whatever he is doing, he's fine. Let him sleep, but it's wouldn't be a bad idea to wake him up once or twice and evaluate his situation. Using the excuse that he should go to the bathroom was the least intrusive way to do this.

Re: Why Do Hospitals Hate Sleep So Much?

#136

Post by mcv »

quwert95 wrote: post #9

I felt the question and answer to be a little flippant, which is fine, but hear this: Sometimes there are reasons, very genuine reasons. I've been recovering from a recent stay. I, too, was interrupted frequently - every 45 minutes in fact. After a few nods off and being woken up by a knock at the door repeatedly I asked 'why' and the staff gently explained that me sleeping for too long would be a bad idea for a few…

Sure, if there's a real medical need to wake the patient up, they should absolutely do so. But waking the patient merely to draw blood in the middle of the night when that could just as easily be done in the morning or evening, is stupid and harmful.

Re: Why Do Hospitals Hate Sleep So Much?

#137

Post by mattjaynes »

I recently had a family member in the intensive care unit (ICU) for over a month in Austin, Texas. I quickly learned my main contribution would be protecting her sleep when I saw she hadn't slept in days because of the constant interruptions. She went from reasonable and compliant in taking her medication, to extremely irritated and noncompliant with the doctors. Of course I could see this was due to sleep deprivation, but when I kept bringing this up to the doctors and nurses, they gave me blank stares and didn't seem to believe or care. When they started suggesting another surgery due to her not improving, I nearly lost my sanity. Ultimately, I had to become a very vocal and unpleasant protector of her sleep - if a nurse came in, I quickly took him/her outside the room and asked what they were planning and whether it was absolutely necessary. This annoyed them quite a bit and they hinted that they could have me removed. It was one of the worst experiences of my life. Just being in the ICU for a month with a loved one is hard enough, but having to battle the staff to protect something so basic as SLEEP so she could recover, made it a true nightmare. Something is truly broken if trained medical staff see sleep as optional - the data and science behind sleep is so compelling, and they don't understand these basics? Desperately frustrating...

Re: Why Do Hospitals Hate Sleep So Much?

#138

Post by xg15 »

quwert95 wrote: post #9

I felt the question and answer to be a little flippant, which is fine, but hear this: Sometimes there are reasons, very genuine reasons. I've been recovering from a recent stay. I, too, was interrupted frequently - every 45 minutes in fact. After a few nods off and being woken up by a knock at the door repeatedly I asked 'why' and the staff gently explained that me sleeping for too long would be a bad idea for a few…

> 3. Having a patient awake for blood draws, or an emergency, is useful. I’m not a small person; turning me over for some blood is much easier if I am awake and cooperative.

> I can imagine anyone with recent head trauma shouldn’t be allowed to sleep either.

Well, yes, it would be enormously practical in a large number of situations if we wouldn't sleep. It would also solve a lot of problems if we didn't need to eat. Problem is, those things are biological necessaries with immediate adverse effects if we neglect them. I also believe there is a solid body of research showing the importance of sleep for recovery.

I'm not a doctor or nurse and the blood flow argument does sound reasonable - however, the other two arguments sound a lot like "it's more practical and less risky for us if you're awake", which I don't see is a valid reason. Also, by what medical school is >45 minutes of uninterrupted sleep "too much"?

Re: Why Do Hospitals Hate Sleep So Much?

#139

Post by brokenmachine »

TheBolivianNavy wrote: post #116
bjackman wrote: post #82

I'm lucky enough never to have been in hospital myself, but FWIW: I was recently on the jury in a coroner's inquest. A patient had died suddenly in his sleep in hospital. The solicitor whose agenda was to make the hospital look bad aimed to suggest that nurses should have been entering his room every 15 minutes to check his breathing, but all medical staff witnesses argued that sleep is too important to disrupt by en…

I know a torch is a flashlight but it amuses me to think of a nurse wielding a flaming torch walking down the hallway, peering into rooms. It's been awhile since I was in a hospital overnight but checking in on a (presumably) stable patient every 15 minutes is madness. You hear all sorts of crazy things during jury duty--I love it.

Of course not a normal patient, but I would imagine that it would not be unreasonable to be checking an ICU patient's vitals every 15 minutes. It's called "intensive care" for a reason.

Re: Why Do Hospitals Hate Sleep So Much?

#140

Post by DINKDINK »

doppel wrote: post #120
CodeAndCuffs wrote: post #30

For both of our children, the hospital caused us more stress and discomfort than anything else. Newborn baby's finally asleep, wife is comfortable re pain, finally start to get some sleep. Then the nurse comes in at 2 am, writes her name on the board, asks us questions that they should have the answer to, then leaves. Nurse change 3x a day, baby doctor checking in to ask if were ok, mom doctor doing the same, house k…

We had our first child ~3 months ago. We had a room to ourselves and nurses/midwifes would only come in once or twice a day unless they were paged (which we did, they were a godsend). This made the stay as comfortable as could be, and we could get all the quiet time alone we wanted, although sleep was in short supply for other reasons. This was in Copenhagen, Denmark, so the entire stay was free. Sadly, the central h…

>Copenhagen, Denmark, so the entire stay was ~~free~~ subsidized.
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