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The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

nytimes.com

31–40 of 155 posts

Re: The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

#31
post #5

because how else they would pilot their flying saucers to earth? https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/octopus-aliens-sc...

Why the downvotes? The article refers to this paper from August this year: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S007961071...

Signed by 33 authors and published in a peer-reviewed, seemingly established journal. Thanks for the pointer!

Re: The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

#32
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what the peak of intelligence means if that is termites, bees, humans? What about dolphins, dogs, not to mention chimpanzees, other great apes are likely smarter then them, but it will take some clever tests and clever categorization of intelligence to understand their sense.

The prominence of the peak. Like how Denali is taller than the mountains around it, but Everest is still the tallest. We're quite close to dolphins and killer whales, so the essence of their intelligence is easier for us to understand, because they are more like us. Bees, termites, ants, etc. are really interesting because any individual is pretty stupid, but the entire swarm is complex and intelligent.

local maxima, in other words. Humans being the global maximum, on Earth at least.

Re: The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

#33

Interesting they say they are solo in this article yet we had articles posted here about nurseries found where hundreds were together https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18335536

There's been a couple reports of this happening (I think I've heard of exactly 2) and only in the last few years. They live very solitary lives, even if they're occasionally alone together.

Re: The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

#34

I would like to keep one for a pet but they only live a few years. Been through that with a rat, won't do it again; even kits and pups only last 15 years or so. too soon

The ones that are small enough to keep as pets don't even live a few years.

Octopus keepers usually keep a second aquarium to grow the octopus's food. So add that to the expense.

Re: The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

#35
How much of an impediment to technological progress would not have being able to tame fire have been?

You probably don't need the warmth underwater, but cooking facilitates nutrient absorption ("exodigestion"?), wards off predators, post-sunset light, and (later) smithing, smelting, steam power etc.

Re: The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

#36
post #21
post #9

The getting coconut shell part doesn't impress much. Even snails or hermit crabs know to find abandoned shells to hide in. Seems pretty natural for that class of animals.

I imagine the difference is that hermit crabs are exhibiting a rote, inborn behavior that is universal among the species. Cephalopods apparently figure this stuff out on the fly.

Not to take away from this point - but I was always curious - Anyone have a summary of how these “rote inbuilt behaviours” work Hardware-wise in living things? Is the research even far along on defining and demarcating behaviours easily based on this?

Re: The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

#37
One theory why primates evolved big brains is because they had hands. Big brains for an animal like a gazelle don’t pay off because, without hands, there isn’t much a gazelle can do with that big brain. Better it use that energy for bigger leg muscles. Primates evolves hands so they could better grasp branches, but, once they had hands, there was a lot more they could do with them, like make tools. A bigger brain for a creature with hands is an evolutionary advantage, because that bigger brain allows complex behaviors that can be carried out with hands. I bet octopuses are intelligent for a similar reason. Its body is like one big hand, and there are lots of complex behaviors it can carry out with those tentacles. Similar for its color changing skin. There are many complex and useful ways that skin can be used, so it pays to have a big brain. The important point is that the bodily appendages came first, and those appendages made it actually useful to have a big brain. I find it more surprising that dolphins became intelligent, but the article is right that living in groups capable of communication and cooperation can similarly make big brains pay off, because the animal can engage in complex group behaviors.

Re: The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

#38
post #5

because how else they would pilot their flying saucers to earth? https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/octopus-aliens-sc...

Why the downvotes? The article refers to this paper from August this year: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S007961071... Signed by 33 authors and published in a peer-reviewed, seemingly established journal. Thanks for the pointer!

The signatories have very poor reputations and their argument is at conflict with most very basic facts about octopus biology

Re: The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

#39
post #18
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want an intelligent pet that will likely outlive you, get a parrot.

Actually, please don't. If you want a pet, adopt a dog or cat from the local shelter. At least they have been domesticated long enough that they are better off under human care. Don't keep an animal that had to be captured and removed from its natural habitat.

Don't get a wild-caught parrot. There are plenty of parrots that need new homes. Get one from a rescue. Or if that won't work (none close enough) get a captive bred bird.

Also be very, very sure you can take care of the bird for the rest of your life, and will have someone that can take over when you die who the bird will already know and be friendly with. Birds are more work than dogs, they need a whole room in your house (at least) to be made safe to fly around in / shred things in, etc. Don't leave a parrot alone with anything you want intact.

All that said they can be very friendly & great companions.

Re: The Octopus Is Smart as Heck, But Why?

#40
post #6
post #3

Octopi are interesting in that they evolved along their own path. The octopus eye has the wiring on the back, where it belongs, instead of on the front blocking some of the light, as most other animals with eyes do.

They apparently also don't require crossing wires connecting each eye with the opposite brain hemisphere. Instead, the optic lobes are directly behind the eyes: http://cephalove.blogspot.com/2010/06/view-of-octopus-brain....

Also, their eye cells only detect black and white but they can probably “see” color by using non-circular pupils.

https://news.berkeley.edu/2016/07/05/weird-pupils-let-octopu...

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