Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Cambridge Analytica Used Fashion Tastes to Identify Right-Wing Voters

nytimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 138 posts

Re: Cambridge Analytica Used Fashion Tastes to Identify Right-Wing Voters

#11

Post by autokad »

everdev wrote: post #4

Unfortunately, stereotypes have utility. No one likes being caught up as a false positive in a stereotype, but when you look at mass market politics / advertising / marketing they cater to charactures of their intended audience because for the most part it seems to work. Every once in a while someone takes it too far and a group gets offended, but let's not pretend that Cambridge is the only one doing this.

one interesting one was that I took 5000 twitter profile photos and averaged the pixel values by male / female. unsurprisingly, the male average had short hair while the woman long. but what did surprise me was that the shirt area of the males had a blue hue and the women had a red one. its not like anyone in particular was wearing red/blue by sex, but on average they were.

Re: Cambridge Analytica Used Fashion Tastes to Identify Right-Wing Voters

#12

Post by NeedMoreTea »

The whole article reads, to me, as "We can sell you ads on the most tenuous associations" as we're too stuck in our own marketing bubble. :)

Stereotypical difference between a peace activist and Wall St banker, sure. No doubt some more subtle variations too. Comparing mainstream brands? That seems a stretch too far to say the least.

Preferences in clothing and music are the leading indicators of political leaning

Or might indicate nationality and age group far more than politics? Music has long heavily influenced clothing.

opting for Levi’s over Rag & Bone makes a statement about associations and history and opens one up to fashion profiling

Or you were born in the 50s and haven't, yet, heard of Rag & Bone, or you prefer Levi's fit, or they're heavier denim. Or you're British and prefer Rag & Bone, as they started here. Or one was on offer at Amazon.

Or your partner chose whichever they prefer on you.

Re: Cambridge Analytica Used Fashion Tastes to Identify Right-Wing Voters

#14

Post by notacoward »

Makes perfect sense. I remember seeing something a while ago about an fMRI study which showed that the difference between "Coke drinkers" and "Pepsi" drinkers had more to do with people's sense of identity than with actual physical enjoyment of each drink. We're probably all familiar with the stereotypes of latte-sipping liberals and beer-swilling conservatives. Are liberals physically different in a way that makes them more likely to enjoy latte? Unlikely.

People identify with brands as reflections of their identity and affiliations all the time. This is especially evident with cars. What kind of person drives a Prius? What kind of person drives an F-150? Don't tell me that mentioning those brands didn't make certain images pop into your head. I drive a Mini and love it, but I'd never buy a BMW 3-series (which is built from many of the same components) because of the brand associations. Of course someone who wears Carhartt is going to fit a different political profile than someone who wears Under Armour. It would be foolish not to use that information in targeting an ad or political campaign.

Re: Cambridge Analytica Used Fashion Tastes to Identify Right-Wing Voters

#15

Post by inetknght »

NeedMoreTea wrote: post #12

The whole article reads, to me, as "We can sell you ads on the most tenuous associations" as we're too stuck in our own marketing bubble. :) Stereotypical difference between a peace activist and Wall St banker, sure. No doubt some more subtle variations too. Comparing mainstream brands? That seems a stretch too far to say the least. Preferences in clothing and music are the leading indicators of political leaning Or…

I don't think it was being used as the sole metric. Rather, I think it'd be used as a weight.

X percent of the population wears A brand, while Y population wears B brand. What correlations can we find in some Z count of reference population? Use that correlation value to infer data where none existed.

Yes, some of that inferred data will be wrong. But a lot won't be. And when you're talking a massive numbers game like millions of voters then you're also talking about accepting that trade-off by hedging against other correlations that can help solidify a potential inference.

Re: Cambridge Analytica Used Fashion Tastes to Identify Right-Wing Voters

#16

Post by inetknght »

carbocation wrote: post #8
everdev wrote: post #4

Unfortunately, stereotypes have utility. No one likes being caught up as a false positive in a stereotype, but when you look at mass market politics / advertising / marketing they cater to charactures of their intended audience because for the most part it seems to work. Every once in a while someone takes it too far and a group gets offended, but let's not pretend that Cambridge is the only one doing this.

Stereotype is probably the correct word, but it's overloaded here. Stereotyping someone by something that they did not choose is a gateway to prejudice: skin color, eye color, place of birth. Stereotyping someone by something that they did choose may be very useful for making inference about them, because it is a revealed preference: clothing tastes, food preferences, etc.

Stereotyping someone by something that you assume they chose is also a gateway to prejudice. @NeedMoreTea said it right by mentioning cases where someone might not have chosen their particular attire.

Re: Cambridge Analytica Used Fashion Tastes to Identify Right-Wing Voters

#17

Post by tokyo_sky_park »

Chris Wylie didn't work at Cambridge Analytica in 2016. He left in 2014 to create his own company, Eunoia Technologies, which was a direct and bitter competitor. The two regularly competed for clients and CA sued Eunoia, alleging that Chris took both clients and data with him when he left. It was a deeply unfriendly parting.

Therefore, Chris has no insider information about what happened at Cambridge Analytica during or in the run up to the presidential election. Therefore, these claims are creative fiction.

Re: Cambridge Analytica Used Fashion Tastes to Identify Right-Wing Voters

#19

Post by sosborn »

inetknght wrote: post #16
carbocation wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stereotype is probably the correct word, but it's overloaded here. Stereotyping someone by something that they did not choose is a gateway to prejudice: skin color, eye color, place of birth. Stereotyping someone by something that they did choose may be very useful for making inference about them, because it is a revealed preference: clothing tastes, food preferences, etc.

Stereotyping someone by something that you assume they chose is also a gateway to prejudice. @NeedMoreTea said it right by mentioning cases where someone might not have chosen their particular attire.

It works on a macro level though. You have to be ok with idea that the stereotype isn’t 100% perfect, it’s just used to get a majority of your target market.
Post reply on HN