Live data from Hacker News

H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

sfchronicle.com

11–20 of 143 posts

Re: H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

#11
I know it's a small constituency, but this makes it difficult for foreign-language schools who want to hire teachers from the "source" country. The timing uncertainty and calendar schedule simply doesn't work.

I am sure there are many such tiny segments.

Re: H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

#12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if you give the visa to the employee, now you run the risk of employers sizing up an employee's status (are they a citizen or an immigrant who needs a job to stay in the country) and hiring or offering salaries based on that. It'll still lead to the wrong behaviors. Citizenship questions are illegal but still get asked. Are you going to outlaw asking about an employee's immigration status? Good luck enforcing th…

My point is that it will make it easier for employees stuck in a bad spot due to employee abuse to switch jobs. Lets say they join the company you cite and the boss dumps 80 hours a week worth of work every week and doesn't pay overtime. Currently it's a huge hassle and risky to switch jobs, so that employee may continue thus hurting the job market. If you give the employee the visa, they can shop around for jobs lik…

In my company most H1 workers that come from Infosys and others are mainly there because they are cheap and not because they are "highly qualified" as the intent of H1 is. If Infosys just had to pay market rates they would lose competitiveness and open up visa spots for the people who truly deserve one.

Re: H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

#13
post #9

Why not just go to an auction system, where the group that is going to give the highest salary gets the visa? You could adjust it for CoL so all H1Bs don't end up in SF and NYC. What would be bad about this system?

In such a system, maybe only experienced hires would get visas and fresh graduates wouldn't.

Re: H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

#14
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is that it will make it easier for employees stuck in a bad spot due to employee abuse to switch jobs. Lets say they join the company you cite and the boss dumps 80 hours a week worth of work every week and doesn't pay overtime. Currently it's a huge hassle and risky to switch jobs, so that employee may continue thus hurting the job market. If you give the employee the visa, they can shop around for jobs lik…

In my company most H1 workers that come from Infosys and others are mainly there because they are cheap and not because they are "highly qualified" as the intent of H1 is. If Infosys just had to pay market rates they would lose competitiveness and open up visa spots for the people who truly deserve one.

If you make it easier for those folks to switch, they will switch away from Infosys to a better job after spending a month or two working for cheap, as you say. If that happens a lot Infosys will stop bringing in new people since they mostly leave early but they already paid for their immigration costs which add up. The employees also will be less inclined to work 80 hrs a week for Infosys to rake in the profits.

If they want to retain people, Infosys will have to increase their salaries to close to market rate by charging the client more, which means the client is less likely to hire from Infosys. Either way it's a win.

Re: H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

#15

> The Department of Homeland Security wants to switch the order of these lotteries, it said in a notice of the proposed rule change, which would — somewhat counterintuitively — improve the odds for those highly educated workers > ... with a master’s or doctoral degree from an American college or university This is a welcome change. But this biases the playing field in favor of those graduating from American degree mi…

>But this biases the playing field in favor of those graduating from American degree mills. Undergrad is very expensive in the US, even at some public universities. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this put American graduates at a disadvantage? If I attend a US public university and pay via loans, I'm now competing for a job with Indian and Chinese students who completed a graduate program (anecdotally, these can…

The problem with this argument is that you're assuming that there's more offer than demand, when in fact is the opposite. This is why tech companies push hard for the H1-B program.

It's possible that there's a large body of citizens with technical degrees that theoretically could fulfill those jobs, but that doesn't mean that they have the skills or the applied knowledge to perform at the standards required for those jobs. People like to poke at this argument, but any technical person knows that claiming that you know a technology (e.g: a programming language) doesn't equal to being great at working with that technology.

Every company has the right to enforce a hiring standard and most top companies will have a very high one. I don't think this has to do at all with formal education but rather with experience and skill. This applies to anyone regardless of nationality or origin.

Anecdotically, some of the best American born programmers I have met in my life, don't have an undergrad degree or dropped before graduating. They are all employed at top companies and have always managed to stay employed and keep growing their incomes steadily.

Either way, H1-B is a mess and should change for the benefit of everyone affected directly and indirectly by it. This means American workers, internation students, foreign talent and companies.

Re: H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

#16
post #9

Why not just go to an auction system, where the group that is going to give the highest salary gets the visa? You could adjust it for CoL so all H1Bs don't end up in SF and NYC. What would be bad about this system?

The big companies with huge pockets will set up shop in small low CoL places and squeeze out smaller research companies out of talented graduate students in high expertise niche fields like research in EE, AI etc. They will be able to outbid anyone local easily since they're already paying a lot for them in SF/NYC/DC/Seattle/Portland/Austin etc.

Re: H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

#17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But this biases the playing field in favor of those graduating from American degree mills. Undergrad is very expensive in the US, even at some public universities. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this put American graduates at a disadvantage? If I attend a US public university and pay via loans, I'm now competing for a job with Indian and Chinese students who completed a graduate program (anecdotally, these can…

The problem with this argument is that you're assuming that there's more offer than demand, when in fact is the opposite. This is why tech companies push hard for the H1-B program. It's possible that there's a large body of citizens with technical degrees that theoretically could fulfill those jobs, but that doesn't mean that they have the skills or the applied knowledge to perform at the standards required for those…

>The problem with this argument is that you're assuming that there's more offer than demand, when in fact is the opposite.

I fundamentally disagree with this statement. At top tech companies, I have come across enough mediocre hires who prepared enough for a technical interview to get "in" the company, but are otherwise doing very mundane work or require a ton of direction.

In industry, I've come across with even worse hires who couldn't even program.

I don't believe there's a shortage of talent in this country.

Re: H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

#18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if you give the visa to the employee, now you run the risk of employers sizing up an employee's status (are they a citizen or an immigrant who needs a job to stay in the country) and hiring or offering salaries based on that. It'll still lead to the wrong behaviors. Citizenship questions are illegal but still get asked. Are you going to outlaw asking about an employee's immigration status? Good luck enforcing th…

My point is that it will make it easier for employees stuck in a bad spot due to employee abuse to switch jobs. Lets say they join the company you cite and the boss dumps 80 hours a week worth of work every week and doesn't pay overtime. Currently it's a huge hassle and risky to switch jobs, so that employee may continue thus hurting the job market. If you give the employee the visa, they can shop around for jobs lik…

>My point is that it will make it easier for employees stuck in a bad spot due to employee abuse to switch jobs.

Sure. I think that's fair, but getting a work visa should be harder in the first place.

One of my previous companies got IT workers heavily through a big contracting company.

We received folks who: 1) Didn't understand their domain 2) Couldn't communicate in English, neither verbal or written

This person clearly never visited a US Consulate, or if they did, they never were asked to speak English. This is not a complaint about an individual's accent or elementary grammar. This person does not know the grammar period. And no, they were not disabled.

Re: H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

#19
post #9

Why not just go to an auction system, where the group that is going to give the highest salary gets the visa? You could adjust it for CoL so all H1Bs don't end up in SF and NYC. What would be bad about this system?

The big companies with huge pockets will set up shop in small low CoL places and squeeze out smaller research companies out of talented graduate students in high expertise niche fields like research in EE, AI etc. They will be able to outbid anyone local easily since they're already paying a lot for them in SF/NYC/DC/Seattle/Portland/Austin etc.

Your downsides are noted and possible, but the big picture of building out in other areas isn't necessarily a bad thing at all. The local bidders already have to compete with remote offers and people leaving.

Re: H-1B visa shift may favor tech companies

#20
post #11

I know it's a small constituency, but this makes it difficult for foreign-language schools who want to hire teachers from the "source" country. The timing uncertainty and calendar schedule simply doesn't work. I am sure there are many such tiny segments.

If your university associated, then you have an unlimited H1-B queue! Not much of a solution, but it is a solution that isn't available to most business types.
Post reply on HN