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U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

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Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#271

Post by brandonmenc »

nonbel wrote: post #262
brandonmenc wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> shameless advertising on products where products that contain obscene amounts of corn syrup are advertised as "fat free" And there are "low carb" products that contain an obscene amount of fat. If people can't count calories, that's their tough luck. It's not rocket science.

In my experience, high fat isnt an issue since it makes you feel full... as long as you also aren't eating a lot ( > 20-100 g/day) of carbs. The real problem is they started pairing sugar and corn syrup and grains in general with high fat food.

> high fat isnt an issue since it makes you feel full

High fiber carbs and protein make you feel full too.

> The real problem is they started pairing sugar and corn syrup and grains in general with high fat food.

aka: calorie dense foods. Also, it's the type of grains they use - low fiber, high GI - not grains in general.

Individual bodies' responses to fat/carb ratios, while different, are marginal, and orders of magnitude less important than total calorie consumption - especially when overeating.

If you're eating 3,000 more calories a day than me, it really doesn't matter that your body, for example, stores 10% more fat from carbs than mine does.

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#272

Post by brandonmenc »

hrktb wrote: post #255
brandonmenc wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> shameless advertising on products where products that contain obscene amounts of corn syrup are advertised as "fat free" And there are "low carb" products that contain an obscene amount of fat. If people can't count calories, that's their tough luck. It's not rocket science.

> It's not rocket science. Yet there’s no reliable research that proves how all of that works in most people nor how the situation can be solved at large scale. I think it’s a way harder problem than flying rockets.

Eat fewer and burn more calories. It's a simple recipe that is supported by the bulk of scientific research.

Educating people, modifying their behavior, and increasing their willpower and persistence is what's difficult - that's a sociological problem and I agree, a hard one. The actual physical mechanism is simple.

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#273

Post by jobigoud »

refurb wrote: post #133
jobigoud wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most natural disasters ultimately increase GDP and are good for the economy. It's a weird metric.

Disasters increase GDP? How? The money spent rebuilding a country is money not spent on other things.

> The money spent rebuilding a country is money not spent on other things

Money is created when needed (loans, etc.), it's not a zero-sum game. Money is invested in depolluting, rebuilding roads, etc. That contributes to the GDP, sometimes more than the destruction impaired production.

For example rebuilding roads after an earthquake creates many jobs.

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#274

Post by hrktb »

brandonmenc wrote: post #272
hrktb wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not rocket science. Yet there’s no reliable research that proves how all of that works in most people nor how the situation can be solved at large scale. I think it’s a way harder problem than flying rockets.

Eat fewer and burn more calories. It's a simple recipe that is supported by the bulk of scientific research. Educating people, modifying their behavior, and increasing their willpower and persistence is what's difficult - that's a sociological problem and I agree, a hard one. The actual physical mechanism is simple.

> The actual physical mechanism is simple

Sure. Running faster is also just increasing the power to weight ratio.

You are technically right, but nobody doubts the high level physics of it, it’s the biology part that is complex.

Even leaving aside socio-economic factors and pure behavior issues, it’s not just a “throw things in and you can predict what goes out”. Knowing how different bodies manage food intake, food processing and retention, then come up with a calory burning budget is damn hard. We’re not pipes, a lot of things happen in the body.

I know it’s so much more comfortable to think it’s simple, but I think we need the courage to accept it’s not as straightforward as motivational poster would want us to believe.

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#275

Post by 18pfsmt »

nonbel wrote: post #261
arbitrary_name wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My dad is dying from a 20 cm tumour right now. He has insurance but put up with the pain of a growing mass in his pancreas and stomach for months because he didn't like going to the doctor. Had we picked it up early, they could have operated and put him on immunotherapy. Please, go to the doctor early and regularly. It's not worth it, trust me.

> "Had we picked it up early, they could have operated and put him on immunotherapy." Your story could be helpful to others. According to the doctors: 1) What is the years survived estimate of this vs doing nothing in your fathers situation (age, stage, etc)? 2) What are the side effects (and in general the quality of life) after/during this treatment vs doing nothing? Also, these should both be some sort of histogra…

My grandfather was born in the 1890's in what was then called Indian Territory (aka Oklahoma). He refused to go to the doctor for his entire life. He had a heart attack at ~70 and died a week later in the hospital. No procedures, drugs, waiting rooms, or paper work. I really admire that approach.

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#276

Post by newnewpdro »

rhplus wrote: post #110
jillesvangurp wrote: post #81

I can think of a few other causes like sickness being a potentially bankrupting event so people don't go to a doctor when they should or too late. This apparently is a risk, even if you have insurance because you are at the mercy of insurers not tossing you out over such whimsical reasons as pre-existing conditions or other bureaucratic tricks they use to kill their customers rather than getting them cured. There are…

shameless advertising on products where products that contain obscene amounts of corn syrup are advertised as "fat free" Ah, yes. In the US, Twizzlers are a "Low fat snack": https://www.hersheys.com/twizzlers/en_us/products/twizzlers-... In Canada, just candy: https://www.hersheys.com/twizzlers/en_ca/products/twizzlers-...

In my teens (90s) I knew an overweight girl who would eat hersheys chocolate syrup straight from the bottle as a "dieting" snack. Her understanding was that it was fat-free, hence non-fattening.

It's sad how much this misunderstanding of fat being fattening has permeated the US population to this day. All the false/misleading information in product advertising has definitely played a significant role, it should be made illegal and enforced with stiff fines.

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#277

Post by nonbel »

brandonmenc wrote: post #271
nonbel wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience, high fat isnt an issue since it makes you feel full... as long as you also aren't eating a lot ( > 20-100 g/day) of carbs. The real problem is they started pairing sugar and corn syrup and grains in general with high fat food.

> high fat isnt an issue since it makes you feel full High fiber carbs and protein make you feel full too. > The real problem is they started pairing sugar and corn syrup and grains in general with high fat food. aka: calorie dense foods. Also, it's the type of grains they use - low fiber, high GI - not grains in general. Individual bodies' responses to fat/carb ratios, while different, are marginal, and orders of ma…

You will just have to try a low carb diet for a week or so to experience the reduced "hunger". It is quite amazing to learn that half the feelings of hunger you feel are due to carbohydrate addiction. You may also experience withdrawal symptoms very similar to those of quitting smoking.

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#278

Post by gizmo385 »

ams6110 wrote: post #237
Jach wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They're there to keep you healthy. This is probably the issue under contention. I don't like doctors either (or really the entire medical establishment). Some part of that is a belief that they aren't in fact there to keep you healthy. No I'm not trying to argue something like profit motives or whatever driving an unethical effort to make you dependent instead of healthy, or say doctors shouldn't exist, or that I w…

Mostly this. I think most doctors mean well but but when you go looking for problems that you are trained to find you usually find something, and medicine is so defensive these days due to malpractice litigation that nothing even slightly anomalous is ever ignored.

> medicine is so defensive these days due to malpractice litigation

Is there any evidence of this? I've seen malpractice litigation similarly cited as one of the reasons behind the the high cost of health care in the US (which is also frequently disputed [1])

[1] https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/04/upshot/malpractice-reform...

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