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Twilight of the Taj Mahal

bbc.co.uk

81–90 of 96 posts

Re: Twilight of the Taj Mahal

#81
post #79
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is why the indirect taxes(fuel), other sales etc taxes are so high. There is also a suggestion that they do away income taxes completely, and may be tax petrol by additional 30 rupees/liter. >>The landlords are fleecing tenants. As of now it takes savings of a life time to afford a home in big cities. Its tenants who are getting the better end of the deal. You have to become a land lord if you are saving up for…

Income tax is ridiculous. Especially in India with the stats I presented. How exactly are tenants getting the better end of the deal? It is the tenenat who: - pays the rent which is arbitrarily high and increases every year thereby offsetting the puny salary hikes - bears the burden of excess tax because the landlord refuses to pay taxes on money earned from rent - has nothing to show for the money spent in rent - lo…

Almost any economy where buying is expensive, renting works out cheaper.

From the perspective of owning a property. You have far higher costs. That starts with firstly buying land and developing it. Money doesn't grow on trees, so you need take out loan, and pay inflation standard interests to do that. This is while you weather lay off risks, and other deprecation costs. At this point in time, in any major city in India, you need 2+ crores to build a decent rental property.

Then come maintenance costs, long term costs of holding the property(Property taxes), holding the risks of encroachment etc.

Secondly your point on taxes on rent is not entirely right. You will be surprised how easy it is to attract audit and raids. It happens all the time.

Lastly. In case of renting you have no loan risk, you have no encroachment risk, you have mobility advantage, you can look for newly developed properties and stay there. You can shift every time you find amenities of a different property to be better. All of this in a pay-as-you-go model.

Re: Twilight of the Taj Mahal

#82
post #44

The monument is being neglected. The current government has an attitude which is very similar to ”not invented here" whereby anything not created by Hindus is not to be valued: https://www.firstpost.com/india/yogi-adiyanath-govt-in-uttar... Hinduism is not a religion like Islam or Christianity. People in India behave as if it is. Our past was glorious. It, however, cannot guarantee a similar future unless people wake…

Apparently most of the Maratha forts built by "Hindus" are also being neglected. The forts that I visited didn't even have presence of officials, let alone repairs(which is being pursued by the current government).

1. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/22/world/asia/taj-mahal-indi...

Re: Twilight of the Taj Mahal

#83
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are redefining investing. It is investing when you are deliberately holding on to something with an expectation of higher returns in future. You are implying that ancestors of these landlords knew business will suddenly bump up in late 90s. It's sheer luck,government complacency and nothing else. If you want to call it investing, fine with me. > Also a lot of middle class can and does invest. Yes the little they…

>>You are implying that ancestors of these landlords 'Ancestors' makes it feel they are from the 15th century. In reality these are people from 1960s/1970s. In most cities at that time buying a property was a no-brainer investment. There were public sector companies springing up all over the place, and the first round of urbanization was well in progress. Also you don't even have to go that far, even in the 1990s, du…

Most of the landlords are not the IT guys mind you. They are mostly the former farmers who have held large pieces of land around towns. I don't know about Bangalore, but farmer communities around Delhi have grown rich by coming together as vote bank and getting compensated multiple times for the same pieces of lad they.

> Also you don't even have to go that far, even in the 1990s, during the peak of onsite-money techies in Bangalore were swimming in, most currently high valued properties in the vicinity of ring-road today were available for almost free(Comparative to IT salaries of the day).

How many were employed in IT during that time? As far as I remember, IT scene exploded circa 2000 onward when likes of TCS, and Infosys started recruiting via truckload. Like 75 - 200 rupees/psqft.

You are implying that every single IT guy had the opportunity to earn mighty. Those few who had the opportunity have done exceptionally anyways but that is a minority.

> Most of the crowd either does not have what it takes to think in terms of such long durations of time.

Yes hence they think of the short term i.e. earning as much as possible via whatever means necessary. My original comment was an answer to GP's moralistic attitude. If that 18 year old kid wants to be a Doctor to earn as much as possible that is because he has seen dumb ass people around him getting richer.

How that is any immoral then someone profiting insanely from something their grandfathers hoarded?

Re: Twilight of the Taj Mahal

#84
post #81
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Income tax is ridiculous. Especially in India with the stats I presented. How exactly are tenants getting the better end of the deal? It is the tenenat who: - pays the rent which is arbitrarily high and increases every year thereby offsetting the puny salary hikes - bears the burden of excess tax because the landlord refuses to pay taxes on money earned from rent - has nothing to show for the money spent in rent - lo…

Almost any economy where buying is expensive, renting works out cheaper. From the perspective of owning a property. You have far higher costs. That starts with firstly buying land and developing it. Money doesn't grow on trees, so you need take out loan, and pay inflation standard interests to do that. This is while you weather lay off risks, and other deprecation costs. At this point in time, in any major city in In…

> Almost any economy where buying is expensive, renting works out cheaper.

Cheaper than buying. In the short term, maybe.

You make property ownership look like slavery while renters seem to be just enjoying the ride.

If it is so hard and unrewarding to build rental properties it seems landlords are just addicted to losing money.

Re: Twilight of the Taj Mahal

#85
What a shame, it's literally falling apart. I remember visiting the Taj Mahal back in the day (15-20 years ago) on a full moon night, do they still open on certain nights? Imagine how it would shimmer in the dark, if they still had all the precious stones encrusted in the marble!

Re: Twilight of the Taj Mahal

#86
>In 1998 the Supreme Court established a special exclusion area to keep heavy industry at a distance from the monument. The Taj Trapezium Zone (TTZ) covers an area of more than 10,400 sq km.

How was this ever going to be workable in a country like India, with so much unemployment and massive requirement for industry, power, infrastructure etc. In these scant conditions, obviously there will be little resources for cleaner, greener alternatives to fulfill economic requirements. And because people are resourceful they will make do with whatever is at hand which for example are, unfortunately, the dirtier diesel generators, coal fired plants, and polluting vehicles. All this is tragec to be sure, but people will choose their own livelihoods over a beautiful mausoleum.

Re: Twilight of the Taj Mahal

#87
post #10

"Incredible India", as the country's tourism slogan claims, is fast disappearing. I know this may get downvoted by fans of India, but I'm just saying it as I see it. If it matters, I'm of Indian origin too. First of all, India has everything it needs to be amazing. A young workforce, driven, technical people, a nice selection of flourishing industries, bucket loads of natural resources and abundant sources of renewab…

Cold hearted profiteering isn't evil. If done properly it will save India. Even with "socialist principles" guiding our governments, cold hearted profiteering has survived and thrived. Rather than using this natural impulse for good, the socialist idiocy has instead resulted in crony thievery.

Re: Twilight of the Taj Mahal

#88
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> government has an attitude which is very similar to ”not invented here" whereby anything not created by Hindus is not to be valued Curious, what are list which is created by Hindus which is well maintained and valued by government?

Another handle created merely minutes ago merely to reply to comments. How frequently do you people monitor forums like HN? How many people work on this? Must be a dream job to get paid to read HN all day.

I don't know about the other guy, but hopefully you'll bear with me since I've been on HN for a while now and wasn't paid by a government IT cell to comment (since you seem to be implying that).

I am not sure what the parent commenter means by "Hinduism is not a religion like Islam or Christianity". Do they mean that Hindus don't practice Abrahamic principles? Because other than that, I'm not able to understand what they mean.

Re: Twilight of the Taj Mahal

#89
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>You are implying that ancestors of these landlords 'Ancestors' makes it feel they are from the 15th century. In reality these are people from 1960s/1970s. In most cities at that time buying a property was a no-brainer investment. There were public sector companies springing up all over the place, and the first round of urbanization was well in progress. Also you don't even have to go that far, even in the 1990s, du…

Most of the landlords are not the IT guys mind you. They are mostly the former farmers who have held large pieces of land around towns. I don't know about Bangalore, but farmer communities around Delhi have grown rich by coming together as vote bank and getting compensated multiple times for the same pieces of lad they. > Also you don't even have to go that far, even in the 1990s, during the peak of onsite-money tech…

>>Most of the landlords are not the IT guys mind you.

Yes, that exactly what I'm saying. If you have a 20+ year timescale you don't have to earn very high to make these investments.

>>but farmer communities around Delhi have grown rich by coming together as vote bank and getting compensated multiple times for the same pieces of lad they.

They have a right to. Getting rich isn't exactly a crime.

>>How many were employed in IT during that time? As far as I remember, IT scene exploded circa 2000 onward when likes of TCS, and Infosys started recruiting via truckload. Like 75 - 200 rupees/psqft.

Plenty. There was also Gulf money. The real issue is, again, very few people can think on a 20+ year timescale.

>>You are implying that every single IT guy had the opportunity to earn mighty.

To be super frank with you. These were throwaway prices even back then. Most investors turn out be people with retirement money, many times Auto drivers, small kirana shop owners etc. Which is why there is so much resentment now. There are people who had 100x advantage over these people, and there has been drastic reshuffling of seats.

>>If that 18 year old kid wants to be a Doctor to earn as much as possible that is because he has seen dumb ass people around him getting richer.

There is nothing dumb about making long term investment decisions.

>>How that is any immoral then someone profiting insanely from something their grandfathers hoarded?

Nothing immoral going on here. Somebody decided to work hard, invest in lands, and ensure their grandkids are well off. If you don't want to invest and do all this, it's really your choice. Why do you suggest others make the same mistake?

Re: Twilight of the Taj Mahal

#90
post #84
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Almost any economy where buying is expensive, renting works out cheaper. From the perspective of owning a property. You have far higher costs. That starts with firstly buying land and developing it. Money doesn't grow on trees, so you need take out loan, and pay inflation standard interests to do that. This is while you weather lay off risks, and other deprecation costs. At this point in time, in any major city in In…

> Almost any economy where buying is expensive, renting works out cheaper. Cheaper than buying. In the short term, maybe. You make property ownership look like slavery while renters seem to be just enjoying the ride. If it is so hard and unrewarding to build rental properties it seems landlords are just addicted to losing money.

That's a decision for you to make.

Different people like to look at the situation differently. I gave you a perspective on buying a home.

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