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U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

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Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#111

Post by Alex_Fragd »

jobigoud wrote: post #96
adventured wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Suicide rates in several other developed nations are either higher or compable to the US. Things must be really, really bad in Belgium, Finland and Iceland eh (you know, just three of the nicest countries on Earth). How could Sweden, France and Australia be anywhere near the US rate? Suicide rates in order per 100k: South Korea 20.2, Belgium 15.7, Japan 14.3, Finland 13.8, US 13.3, Iceland 13.3, France 12.1, Sweden 1…

Belgium has decriminalized euthanasia, maybe that plays a role...

Should euthanasia be included in suicide rates though?

Honest question, I really dont know.

Having a terminal illness at age 90 and being clinically depressed at age 18 are very different things (obviously).

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#112

Post by ethbro »

andrepd wrote: post #95
nonbel wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"In the very near future when climate change has destroyed out planet" Maybe people are killing themselves because they are addicted to the fear porn spread by mainstream/social media regarding "climate change". I don't mean this as a joke, I was addicted to financial/economic fear porn for a bit and it did have a negative effect on my outlook.

Climate change is on track to cause catastrophic damage in the next few decades AND there is no indication of anything being seriously done about this. In other words, a train is barrelling and, crucially, there are no signs of anyone intending to stop it. Yeah, I think it's justified to be scared.

I believe the parent's point was not about the veracity of climate change, but rather the impact of constant exposure to fear.

Herbert's quip that "Fear is the mind killer" is apt.

Research (has hit the HN front page several times) bears out the fact that constant exposure to stress decreases IQ.

Ergo, the first step to most effectively combating anything is to accept it, but NOT give in to fear and despair.

Climate change is real. We are not doing enough to counteract it. But we can.

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#113

Post by WhompingWindows »

kauffj wrote: post #65
pjc50 wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People have gone to a lot of effort to convince their fellow Americans that those that die from opioids deserve it. I'm sure some will turn up in this thread.

"Deserve" is going overboard, but there's certainly a moral difference between something that happens due to one's own choices, vs. something that happens because it was compelled. It's reasonable have more sympathy for a conscripted soldier killed in a foreign war he had no desire to fight in than an opioid addict that died from a result of choosing to do drugs.

You're perpetuating a myth that drug use is all about personal choice. Many addicts started with prescription opioids, recommended by their doctor, and only moved to more dangerous options once their doctor's supply was extinguished. Doctors themselves over-prescribed these to attack pain, meanwhile they were being lied to by pharma about the addictiveness of opioids. On top of that, you have fentanyl being added to heroin to increase its potency, and also vastly increase the mortality rate.

Finally, it may be hard for those of us who were never addicted to opioids to understand. It no longer becomes a simple choice when your body is extremely sick if you don't get your dose. This is one reason why a drug addict might steal from those they love, their illness is literally the most important physical sensation at any moment, overcoming familial and societal norms. It's a scourge and illness, not merely a choice.

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#114

Post by elocinstr8t »

"Life expectancy for Americans fell again last year, despite growing recognition of the problems driving the decline and federal and local funds invested in stemming them."

If lack of awareness isn't the problem, then what is? What drives people to end their lives? Is it the way we live our lives? The people around us and our inner demons telling us it's the only way to stop the pain? And would projects involving life extension work and make them not go through their plan of taking their own lives?

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#117

Post by dahart »

beginningguava wrote: post #29

The opioid epidemic is an amazing example of human psychology and the power of a visual. More people die from it every year than Vietnam, yet there's been no large public outcry to resolve the situation because it isn't right in your face like a 9/11 or pearl harbor. Even ignoring the human impact and just going to economics, those lost lives will cost the US billions in lost productivity over time, yet nobody really…

I heard an interesting podcast about how the pain scale used in hospitals and clinics is directly responsible for the opioid crisis, and it was intentionally designed to sell pain killers. You know the sheet you get when you visit a doctor that asks “how severe is your pain on a scale of 1-10”?

The well intentioned scientist (June Dahl) who championed the widespread adoption of the pain scale recalls that when she was giving talks about it and it started to get a little traction, the pharma industry started pouring money into her campaign. At the time she thought it was just unbiased grant money without an agenda, but she later realized the intent was to sell more drugs.

https://www.gimletmedia.com/science-vs/opioids-how-america-g...

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#118

Post by harperlee »

cwperkins wrote: post #59
harperlee wrote: post #22

The world definitevely needs to move past GDP as key metric to evaluate success of a nation.

What does this contribute exactly to conversation about this topic? Most people when evaluating success of a country take into account a slurry of values such as GDP, Life Expectancy, GDP Per Capita (more important than GDP IMO), Unemployment, Fertility, Education, Income Inequality. Take a look at the OECD data sheet for the United States: https://data.oecd.org/united-states.htm . Comments like this just scream Amer…

It is not America hating, as this is not just an issue for US. Sorry if it sounded that way.

You are right in that there are more indicators already defined, but you don’t see presidents boasting these figures - and even press and newspapers focus way more on economy and GDP. It’s simply more important in most heads, in my opinion, and this whould change (again my opinion!)

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#119

Post by josho »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #81

I can think of a few other causes like sickness being a potentially bankrupting event so people don't go to a doctor when they should or too late. This apparently is a risk, even if you have insurance because you are at the mercy of insurers not tossing you out over such whimsical reasons as pre-existing conditions or other bureaucratic tricks they use to kill their customers rather than getting them cured. There are…

> people don't go to a doctor when they should or too late

I saw this when travelling in the US for work. (I am Canadian). Striking up conversations in restaurants I met staff that worked while sick because they couldn't afford to take sick days, or worked with chronic conditions because they couldn't afford a visit to a doctor.

Even worse are the major chronic diseases from our lifestyle (hypertension, diabetes, etc). These are largely preventable or manageable with early care. But, if folks don't see their doctor then the severity of the disease grows until treatment becomes something major like surgery or an ER trip (both much more expensive than preventive care).

In short. Yes, the US healthcare system is broken. Interestingly one political party's solution is to blame a past president and continue to undermine what you have, while the other party is content with the existing for profit model.

Re: U.S. Life Expectancy Falls Further

#120

Post by Alex_Fragd »

adventured wrote: post #87
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To me, it seems like life exectancy will improve again as the economy improves and governments find ways to fight fentynal. I find this exceedingly difficult to believe in the rural areas of the US. The current expansion is almost the longest on record, going on since 2009. The structural forces that have hollowed out the economies of rural areas (widening inequality, e-commerce, globalization, etc.) are only incre…

The biggest problem in the overdose spike is that fentanyl is killing very large numbers of people that otherwise might not have died of overdoses from heroin a decade or more ago. The US is being blasted from outside by huge quantities of fentanyl, primarily by China. It's bordering on an act of war (Opium War style). The notion that China can't stop the fentanyl pouring out of their country toward the US is ridicul…

I suspect that if a different country started producing fentanyl on the scale that China does, but offered it at a 10% reduced price, we would purchase the drug from that country instead.

then the blame would shift from China to the new country.

maybe instead of blaming others, we should fix ourselves. stop buying cheap dangerous drugs and decriminalize the drugs we do have

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