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Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

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Re: Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

#31

Post by tgsovlerkhgsel »

mogadsheu wrote: post #2

Seems like a small fine, compared to the potential financial benefit of that installation. Hopefully it serves as a deterrent for future adware installs. If not, maybe we start calling our lawmakers. For those of you in the adware space, would you pay >$10 per head to install your adware onto a computer? My guess is absolutely.

The article mentions another $7M worth of fines, and that's just for the US.

Also, they sold their customers pretty cheap, so the combined fines likely significantly exceed the profit from the deal: https://www.forbes.com/sites/thomasbrewster/2015/02/27/lenov...

While I do think the punishment should be significantly more severe (including jail time for executives), I suspect the scandal has made companies aware that this is a bad idea.

I still don't get why it didn't hurt them more in the enterprise space (read: why large companies didn't institute a strict "no lenovo" policy for a couple years). That would have been way more effective than fines.

Re: Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

#32

Post by tgsovlerkhgsel »

shmerl wrote: post #21

Didn't they also install some malware in UEFI at one point? Which is even worse, since you can install Linux on Lenovo laptops wiping out their pre-installed (but non refundable) Windows, but you can't easily replace UEFI there.

They did have a firmware-based malware dropper. The "only" thing it did was re-infect clean Windows installations, so installing Linux would still mean you'd be fine as the second stage wouldn't be dropped, but of course that's not a technical limitation - they could have built it to also infect Linux, but didn't.

Re: Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

#33

Post by Joakal »

ekianjo wrote: post #29
paranoidrobot wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This descends pretty quickly into politics, but Nationalised infrastructure should be managed by a government organisation who's goal is to deliver a quality product at (or slightly above) cost. These organisations in turn report to the executive government of the day, who's interests should be aligned with that of the citizens they were elected to represent.

Nationalized infrastructure is a good way to create poor service, and a long lasting debt. Look at pretty much every country in Europe with national railtracks and rail lines: massively bleeding money, with worse and worse service and low levels of investements because there is no incentive to do so.

Is there a private train company that has good service, regularly invests and is profitable without government assistance?

Re: Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

#34

Post by moscovium »

mogadsheu wrote: post #2

Seems like a small fine, compared to the potential financial benefit of that installation. Hopefully it serves as a deterrent for future adware installs. If not, maybe we start calling our lawmakers. For those of you in the adware space, would you pay >$10 per head to install your adware onto a computer? My guess is absolutely.

I read the headline thinking it was a purchasing deal, not a fine...

Re: Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

#35

Post by closeparen »

35345dfgd wrote: post #16
lamlam wrote: post #12

I'm always surprised that Lenovo use in the enterprise space didn't take a hit after all this came to light. I would have thought competitors like Dell and HPE would have used that opportunity to disparage Lenovo.

No enterprise is using the base windows image that came from Lenovo with the superfish malware. They all build their own standard operating environment image that would not include the Lenovo bloatware. I would be surprised if Lenovo enterprises even realized they were shipping this way and have no reason to react negatively. Their competitors also live in glass houses and so cannot throw stones.

Lenovo is behaving as an attacker against its customers. That sophisticated customers had defenses for this particular attack is irrelevant. Imagine if iPhones started trying dictionary attacks against their peers on WiFi networks. Would you shrug it off and continue buying Apple products because you trust your password complexity rules?

It’s great that the countermeasures worked this time, but Lenovo is still your adversary. They deserve the same response as any other insider who tries to MITM your traffic: immediate termination, a thorough search for any remaining implants, and an FBI battering ram through their door.

Re: Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

#36

Post by int_19h »

freediver wrote: post #24

IBM Thinkpad t43p was my first heavy duty laptop. In 2005 IBM made a mistake that someone in their management must regret to date, selling Thinkpad laptop line to Lenovo. Things went downhill for Thinkpads and I lasted 3-4 more generations before finally giving up. Thinkpad had a shot at being the world's most loved laptop, by developers and businessman on the go. Passion for great products and great user experience…

Thing is, Thinkpads are still the best productivity laptops on the market. Which isn't to say that your observations aren't true, but more of a comment on the general state of that market...

Re: Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

#37

Post by jhoh »

I recently was asked by my girlfriends sister to help her choose a laptop. After finding a model that looked good spec-wise I searched for that same model but without Windows pre-installed. It was 150€ cheaper. Then I got a 10€ Windows 10 key from ebay, installed O&O ShutUp and Winaero Tweaker and now it almost feels like a great system that you can actually work with.

Vendor-bloatware has been bad since Windows 7 but now that even Microsoft chose to ship Windows itself with ads, pre-installed garbage like Candy Crush Saga and that annoying Cortana I can't imagine going back to it.

Re: Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

#38

Post by jldugger »

tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #31
mogadsheu wrote: post #2

Seems like a small fine, compared to the potential financial benefit of that installation. Hopefully it serves as a deterrent for future adware installs. If not, maybe we start calling our lawmakers. For those of you in the adware space, would you pay >$10 per head to install your adware onto a computer? My guess is absolutely.

The article mentions another $7M worth of fines, and that's just for the US. Also, they sold their customers pretty cheap, so the combined fines likely significantly exceed the profit from the deal: https://www.forbes.com/sites/thomasbrewster/2015/02/27/lenov... While I do think the punishment should be significantly more severe (including jail time for executives), I suspect the scandal has made companies aware that…

> I still don't get why it didn't hurt them more in the enterprise space (read: why large companies didn't institute a strict "no lenovo" policy for a couple years). That would have been way more effective than fines.

Using vendor OS images is a rookie mistake in the first place.

Re: Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

#39

Post by ekianjo »

Joakal wrote: post #33
ekianjo wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nationalized infrastructure is a good way to create poor service, and a long lasting debt. Look at pretty much every country in Europe with national railtracks and rail lines: massively bleeding money, with worse and worse service and low levels of investements because there is no incentive to do so.

Is there a private train company that has good service, regularly invests and is profitable without government assistance?

Yup. Numerous private train companies in Japan.

Re: Lenovo to pay $7.3M for installing adware in laptops

#40

Post by krylon »

tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #31
mogadsheu wrote: post #2

Seems like a small fine, compared to the potential financial benefit of that installation. Hopefully it serves as a deterrent for future adware installs. If not, maybe we start calling our lawmakers. For those of you in the adware space, would you pay >$10 per head to install your adware onto a computer? My guess is absolutely.

The article mentions another $7M worth of fines, and that's just for the US. Also, they sold their customers pretty cheap, so the combined fines likely significantly exceed the profit from the deal: https://www.forbes.com/sites/thomasbrewster/2015/02/27/lenov... While I do think the punishment should be significantly more severe (including jail time for executives), I suspect the scandal has made companies aware that…

> I suspect the scandal has made companies aware that this is a bad idea.

I kind of wonder how many people were like, "pre-install adware on PCs? Why didn't I think of that?!?"

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