How Restaurants Got So Loud • Hacker News Board

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#201

Post by d--b » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 5:55 PM UTC

compiler-guy wrote: post #198

d--b wrote: post #197

> Restaurants are so loud because architects don’t design them to be quiet. Wrong. Restaurants are so loud because people are so loud. My wife and I were at Freeman's in Downtown Manhattan the other day. It was so loud we decided to scream to see if anyone noticed. And since noone seemed to turn their heads, we screamed louder and louder, and literally no one could hear us. This is an American thing, it doesn't happe…

Yes, Americans are loud. But the acoustics of the space one talks do in fact make a difference. If the surrounding space reflects a lot of sound, the restaurant will be louder than if the surrounding space absorbs a lot of sound. And that, in fact is what the article is about.

sure, yes, but architects _never_ paid attention to acoustics when designing restaurants (or maybe the very few super sound-concious).

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#202

Post by bllguo » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 5:55 PM UTC

decebalus1 wrote: post #182

jlokier wrote: post #108

There's an ice cream and bagel place in town. In the late evening it's consistently packed with people on their laptops or reading books. One day I noticed the music was much louder than usual, and asked the staff to turn it down. I figured it was a mistake because it was normally much quieter. They told me this was the new company policy. To set the music uncomfortably loud to make people leave, after finishing thei…

It probably won't be the most popular opinion but I'm siding with the business for this one. I never got people who use cafe bars, delis, etc.. as personal offices. I personally can't get 'in the zone' in such a public place where: - I need to buy/consume something every X minutes - have to overhear irrelevant stupid/mundane conversations - people have a habit of bringing their dogs everywhere now and I'm not even go…

Well yes, the business has the right to do what it did, of course. Really no way to knock it other than saying "I don't like that kind of store."

However, there are other shops that actively cultivate the kind of culture you mention. Starbucks is probably the most prominent. It's something that Starbucks deliberately promoted since inception.

You seem already aware that it's nice to have a 3rd place besides home and work. But once it's a coffee shop you don't get it?

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#203

Post by Zofren » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 5:59 PM UTC

decebalus1 wrote: post #182

jlokier wrote: post #108

There's an ice cream and bagel place in town. In the late evening it's consistently packed with people on their laptops or reading books. One day I noticed the music was much louder than usual, and asked the staff to turn it down. I figured it was a mistake because it was normally much quieter. They told me this was the new company policy. To set the music uncomfortably loud to make people leave, after finishing thei…

It probably won't be the most popular opinion but I'm siding with the business for this one. I never got people who use cafe bars, delis, etc.. as personal offices. I personally can't get 'in the zone' in such a public place where: - I need to buy/consume something every X minutes - have to overhear irrelevant stupid/mundane conversations - people have a habit of bringing their dogs everywhere now and I'm not even go…

I'm okay with the 30-minute Wi-Fi policy, but the loud music just makes it unpleasant to be in a restaurant even for a short date/meeting/chat. If restaurants really want to make sure customers aren't staying for too long, they should just make it a matter of policy instead of ruining the experience entirely.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#204

Post by dylan604 » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 6:00 PM UTC

crooked-v wrote: post #181

solatic wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can still find places where you can be served a beverage of your choice in a comfortable chair and tranquil setting. They just tend to have membership fees.

I'm curious what places you're talking about.

In the UK, private membership clubs are a thing. I'd assume it's not just a UK thing, but I have a friend that is a member at one just to have a place to get out of the house and have a quiet place to go work. Cheaper than renting an actual office, and he doesn't need it everyday. For people that do not work from home, it is quite shocking when you realize how not-quite home can be. Primarily if you have family. Other family members "forget" you're actually working, and have no problem interrupting. Not to say in an office co-workers have no problem interrupting either, but that's a different conversation.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#205

Post by err4nt » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 6:01 PM UTC

lazerwalker wrote: post #171

err4nt wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how obvious some people make it that they don't want business. I don't really care about power plugs or wifi when I visit a café (my battery running out is a great motivator + natural time limit, I can tether to my phone for internet) but I always pay close attention to how a new café is outfitted. Some cafés that genuinely want your business make plugs available to the customers, some will even go as far…

It's not fair to say they "don't want business". They don't want certain forms of business — laptop coworkers — that in many cases are both low-profit customers and actively limit the throughput of total customers. I had a good chat once with a guy who runs a small coffee roastery and number of fancy third-wave coffee shops in a posh university town. One of the most popular coffee shops in town went completely bankru…

The closest café to me is a 'concept café' being run by a local coffee roaster. I'll often go The problem with that café is their hours miss both the before-work rush, and the after-work rush, with them closing shop at 6pm. You have to be _open_ to take money.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#206

Post by trophycase » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 6:02 PM UTC

Kurtz79 wrote: post #170

err4nt wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how obvious some people make it that they don't want business. I don't really care about power plugs or wifi when I visit a café (my battery running out is a great motivator + natural time limit, I can tether to my phone for internet) but I always pay close attention to how a new café is outfitted. Some cafés that genuinely want your business make plugs available to the customers, some will even go as far…

If by "business" you mean buying a coffee in exchange of several hours of free internet, electricity and real estate, then it is sort of understandable why many places don't encourage this kind of "business". Some places do, and you have all the reasons in the world to favor these places as they match your needs, but it seems kind of silly expecting that every place should cater to every type of customer.

It's unfortunate that people waste so much energy being plugged in when they don't need to be

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#207

Post by err4nt » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 6:02 PM UTC

amluto wrote: post #138

err4nt wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how obvious some people make it that they don't want business. I don't really care about power plugs or wifi when I visit a café (my battery running out is a great motivator + natural time limit, I can tether to my phone for internet) but I always pay close attention to how a new café is outfitted. Some cafés that genuinely want your business make plugs available to the customers, some will even go as far…

In Palo Alto, there’s a cafe (more or less) call Hana House that has three big sections. One of those sections is very comfy, quiet, has proper acoustic design, lots of outlets, and, gasp charges for time. It’s actually a fairly nice model. If you want to work in someone’s commercial space, paying for it is entirely reasonable.

I try to make it profitable if I'm staying longer. If I stay for a long time, I will 'renew' my lease by buying more drinks or snacks :D Places that are friendly and welcoming today…I've gotta make it PROFITABLE for them to stay in business if I want them to be around tomorrow…

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#208

Post by err4nt » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 6:03 PM UTC

Kurtz79 wrote: post #170

err4nt wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how obvious some people make it that they don't want business. I don't really care about power plugs or wifi when I visit a café (my battery running out is a great motivator + natural time limit, I can tether to my phone for internet) but I always pay close attention to how a new café is outfitted. Some cafés that genuinely want your business make plugs available to the customers, some will even go as far…

If by "business" you mean buying a coffee in exchange of several hours of free internet, electricity and real estate, then it is sort of understandable why many places don't encourage this kind of "business". Some places do, and you have all the reasons in the world to favor these places as they match your needs, but it seems kind of silly expecting that every place should cater to every type of customer.

I'll pay for it. Sounds like a win/win unless you hate money.

But who wants to spend any time or money at all in a café that's designed to be hostile to customers?

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#209

Post by err4nt » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 6:05 PM UTC

otterley wrote: post #139

err4nt wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how obvious some people make it that they don't want business. I don't really care about power plugs or wifi when I visit a café (my battery running out is a great motivator + natural time limit, I can tether to my phone for internet) but I always pay close attention to how a new café is outfitted. Some cafés that genuinely want your business make plugs available to the customers, some will even go as far…

They do want business, just not the kind that people who sit and stay bring. When you’re trying to improve your sales velocity, keeping existing customers moving so as not to dissuade new ones from coming in makes sense.

How does an empty café with bored looking staff invite new customers in?

When I go into frequently-empty places I find that the staff, who should have all the time in the world to help, are actually more distant, because they're so used to filling up their time chatting together or doing other stuff that when a customer actually does show up it's like some unforeseen situation they didn't plan for.

Re: How Restaurants Got So Loud

#210

Post by trophycase » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 6:06 PM UTC

simonebrunozzi wrote: post #120

I hate loud restaurants, I hate loud cafes, I hate when I have to listen to dumb music all the f ing time. I am also very surprised that no one has figured out a way to offer a quieter version to customers like me. I'd pay more to have a quieter experience.

Yes nearly everywhere plays music nowadays. I think it's to drown out the feeling of existential dread of actually having to hear yourself. Don't think about it too hard people, just buy more.