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Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

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Re: Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

#71

Post by freeflight »

dpcx wrote: post #33
wyldfire wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet development should take the environment into consideration because it can have massive consequences. Those consequences are ultimately an externality of the development project and evaluating it in advance can help inform the true financials of the project.

I wonder whether those that were taking the environment in to consideration for the development thought beyond the project to what environmental impacts could be lessened by the project. I'm not a Musk fanboy, but if these tunnels will work the way he's suggesting, the amount of traffic that would be removed from the roads (and by extension, the pollution) would probably be a net benefit to the environment.

> traffic that would be removed from the roads (and by extension, the pollution)

I don't understand how any pollution would be removed, just because it's now in tunnels doesn't equal it being gone.

Wouldn't it just be blasted back out through the ventilation system? Or were there plans to build some kind of "pollution scrubbing" into those?

Re: Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

#72

Post by guelo »

imglorp wrote: post #6
ForHackernews wrote: post #2

Well, that was completely predictable. It's not obvious to me that any of the Boring Company plans are anything except vaporware.

I'm curious about the continued negativity on this. Hasn't he pretty much accomplished everything he has said? Batteries, cars, solar, space, it's all working.

The hyperloop has proven to be absolute bullshit, just like knowledgeable engineers predicted at the time it was announced. Which is part of my dislike of him, all the dishonest hype, and the hordes of online defenders like yourself that just talk about the marketing vision but not about the engineering.

Re: Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

#73

Post by bryanlarsen »

simias wrote: post #39
imglorp wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious about the continued negativity on this. Hasn't he pretty much accomplished everything he has said? Batteries, cars, solar, space, it's all working.

IMO his greatest accomplishment by far is Space X, from an engineering perspective it's the one that seems the most impressive and hardest to achieve. Tesla is impressive but it seems more like the success of a vision, making electric cars look cool and inspirational, not "like a real car but eco-friendly and boring". Technologically speaking are they really ahead of the competition? Meanwhile the Boring company and…

> For the former it's mostly that I don't see what he's bringing to the table.

He's trying to build mass transit using sewer tunnel boring machines and sewer tunnel cost structures. It's not "hard" innovation but innovation it is.

Now he's trying to find out if sewer tunnel sized mass transit requires the same level of environmental assessment as mass transit or as sewer tunnels...

Re: Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

#74

Post by dsfyu404ed »

cujo wrote: post #44
dpcx wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder whether those that were taking the environment in to consideration for the development thought beyond the project to what environmental impacts could be lessened by the project. I'm not a Musk fanboy, but if these tunnels will work the way he's suggesting, the amount of traffic that would be removed from the roads (and by extension, the pollution) would probably be a net benefit to the environment.

I would question if it would actually lower traffic, or just allow more people to travel.

>or just allow more people to travel.

Which is an increase in quality of life for those who would have otherwise forgone those trips. Either way it's a win.

Whether it's a big enough win to be worth the cost is a perpetual debate with projects like this.

Re: Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

#75

Post by johnnyfaehell »

macintux wrote: post #32
johnnyfaehell wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can be diplomatic and move things forward or you can be abrasive like Elon and also move forward. Just curious, can you name some people who have been diplomatic and managed to move things as far forward? I honestly can't think of many actual achievers that have been diplomatic about things.

There’s some line to be drawn between acceptable abrasiveness and calling critics pedophiles.

What if said critic is a paedophile or he had a valid reason to believe it such as being told it by lots of locals? If someone is a paedophile, I think to call them it, should be perfectly acceptable.

Re: Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

#76

Post by deegles »

freeflight wrote: post #71
dpcx wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder whether those that were taking the environment in to consideration for the development thought beyond the project to what environmental impacts could be lessened by the project. I'm not a Musk fanboy, but if these tunnels will work the way he's suggesting, the amount of traffic that would be removed from the roads (and by extension, the pollution) would probably be a net benefit to the environment.

> traffic that would be removed from the roads (and by extension, the pollution) I don't understand how any pollution would be removed, just because it's now in tunnels doesn't equal it being gone. Wouldn't it just be blasted back out through the ventilation system? Or were there plans to build some kind of "pollution scrubbing" into those?

I think the tunnels would run electric cars/trains only.

Re: Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

#77

Post by SECProto »

erikig wrote: post #38
jbaczuk wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good question, I imagine because you need the big city, the traffic volume, and potential users to justify the cost of doing such a big project.

The Boring Co isn’t giving up on LA entirely. This was just one test tunnel. They have already succeeded on their other 2 mile test tunnel (Dodger Stadium) and are working to extend that.

Minor nitpick: the 2 mile test tunnel is in Hawthorne (starts at spacex HQ, goes under W 120th). And they stopped it a bit early (possibly because they planned or predicted that this extended route wasnt gonna happen, but that's speculative). Dodger Stadium is their next plan in LA but they haven't started it yet.

Re: Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

#78

Post by dsfyu404ed »

readhn wrote: post #62
exogeny wrote: post #8

“Brentwood Residents Coalition” just screams NIMBY bullshit to me.

would you be ok with tunnel being built under YOUR house (that you own and worked/will be working for for the rest of your life) without consulting with you FIRST?

If the NVH of a train passing through is equal to or less than that of heavy trucks using the main road that's a few hundred feet away I wouldn't care one bit.

Re: Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

#79

Post by thrower123 »

emiliobumachar wrote: post #17
traditionalist wrote: post #10

Why doesn't Musk take his business elsewhere where he's welcome? I can imagine LA being a nightmare for this sort of project. He needs a place where bureaucracy is thinner and people are actually excited about everything new.

Any suggestions? China comes to my mind, but that comes with a whole other can of worms.

China doesn't really need novel technological approaches when they have the political capital and power to just successfully do things the old ways. Moreover, they have an understanding of acceptable losses and human casualties that is more in line with attitudes prevalent when most of European and US basic infrastructure was initially constructed, compared to the extremely safe working conditions now expected in the west.

Re: Boring Co. Drops LA Westside Tunnel Plan

#80

Post by bbeekley »

readhn wrote: post #62
exogeny wrote: post #8

“Brentwood Residents Coalition” just screams NIMBY bullshit to me.

would you be ok with tunnel being built under YOUR house (that you own and worked/will be working for for the rest of your life) without consulting with you FIRST?

Yes, as long as it gets the necessary permits and green-light from my elected officials.

The canceled tunnel was planned to go in about a block from where I currently live and I was excited for it. It wasn't even going to be under Brentwood (the northern terminus was about 2.5 mi away from the nearest edge). The hypothetical question for the plaintiffs might better be: would you be ok with a tunnel being built between 2-4 mi away from your house after successfully consulting with your elected representatives?

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