The World's Most Underpaid Profession (creating an economy for great teachers)
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Re: The World's Most Underpaid Profession (creating an economy for great teachers)
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As a teacher in Milwaukee Public Schools, I tend to think that there is a direct correlation between socioeconomic status (SES) and student performance. Students who come from homes where their parents are educated and have jobs and take care of their kids likely are not in the lowest SES categories so they are expected to do well and work hard on school. Kids in this situation generally meet their learning goals.
Kids that have no parental support are common in the lowest SES situations. These kids basically have to raise themselves and their younger siblings because mom or dad aren't there. It takes a lot of training and an amazing school environment to lift kids out of these situations and keep them on pace with their learning.
The big reason why performance based pay for teachers is such a hot issue (besides the fact that teachers WILL cheat on their students tests to get their bonuses) is that every community has such a wide array of challenges to overcome. Kids from one area of Milwaukee have very different environments from the kids across town, for example. It's hard to determine benchmarks for performance when the kids are operating at such different stages of development.
Re: The World's Most Underpaid Profession (creating an economy for great teachers)
#3HN Version of the comment I posted on your site: _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ As a teacher in Milwaukee Public Schools, I tend to think that there is a direct correlation between socioeconomic status (SES) and student performance. Students who come from homes where their parents are educated and have jobs and take care of their kids likely are not in the lowest SES categories so they are expected to do well and work hard on sch…
> It's hard to determine benchmarks for performance when the kids are operating at such different stages of development.
Agreed - the point I'm striving for is an incentive conceived from shared gains (you benefit directly from creating value) rather than evaluation by proxy (performance evaluation). It's possibly too theoretical a point to be of much value though, I see that :)
Re: The World's Most Underpaid Profession (creating an economy for great teachers)
#4HN Version of the comment I posted on your site: _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ As a teacher in Milwaukee Public Schools, I tend to think that there is a direct correlation between socioeconomic status (SES) and student performance. Students who come from homes where their parents are educated and have jobs and take care of their kids likely are not in the lowest SES categories so they are expected to do well and work hard on sch…
Thanks for your thoughts! > It's hard to determine benchmarks for performance when the kids are operating at such different stages of development. Agreed - the point I'm striving for is an incentive conceived from shared gains (you benefit directly from creating value) rather than evaluation by proxy (performance evaluation). It's possibly too theoretical a point to be of much value though, I see that :)
Re: The World's Most Underpaid Profession (creating an economy for great teachers)
#5Interesting, but how would this work for students who had an awful teacher? I would feel angry knowing that substandard teachers were earning the same amount as one who were positively influential?
I suppose you could have a rating system whereby the student could rate the teacher and a higher rating would correspond to a fairer percentage.
But then this might backfire on good teachers who have to deal with problematic students. Maybe the teacher is doing a good job in this case but will get a bad rating for nothing of their doing.
Re: The World's Most Underpaid Profession (creating an economy for great teachers)
#6"what if we gave teachers a fraction of a percentage of her pupils' future earnings?" Interesting, but how would this work for students who had an awful teacher? I would feel angry knowing that substandard teachers were earning the same amount as one who were positively influential? I suppose you could have a rating system whereby the student could rate the teacher and a higher rating would correspond to a fairer per…
A problem is that a successful entrepreneur or hedgie is still more likely to come from a middle or upper class background and can easily make 1000x the return of other professions (which are more credential based, and hence a more level playing field for lower class students.). Hence, even at high valuations, investing in motivated, intelligent, well connected students may be the best investment.
Year on year changes would help ensure teachers were compensated fairly, as long as the market provided some kind of feedback to let parents and students evaluate teachers. I assume there is far greater variation among students and among teachers than between the teaching value offered by the same teacher to different students, but that may not be the case.
I don't really think this scheme is workable, but it provides the right economic incentives to everyone.
Re: The World's Most Underpaid Profession (creating an economy for great teachers)
#7Re: The World's Most Underpaid Profession (creating an economy for great teachers)
#8Re: The World's Most Underpaid Profession (creating an economy for great teachers)
#9Wouldn't that also lead to incentives for teachers to encourage students towards professions that would have greater future earnings? Thereby discouraging them from fields that may be useful to society but not that economically viable (I shudder at the thought of every teacher encouraging their students to work on wall street :) )
Re: The World's Most Underpaid Profession (creating an economy for great teachers)
#10How would anyone know what percentage of my success went to each specific teacher of the 50 or more I had over my lifetime? Was it the teacher who taught me how to read and write, the one who taught me basic math or the one who taught me higher level skills that should earn the highest percentage? Maybe it was the one who showed the biggest interest in getting me on the right track when I deviated? There are so many…