I found the answer really interesting: with bitcoin, what you actually own in a technical sense is the cryptographic signature of an output of a previous transaction on the blockchain. "Owning 10 bitcoin" is intrinsically identical to "owning the cryptographic keys to a previous transaction whose value was 10 bitcoin, proving you were the recipient and can therefore initiate a new transaction with the previous transaction's output as an input, thus paying 10 bitcoin to someone else."
What do you legally “own” with Bitcoin? A short introduction to krypto-property
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Re: What do you legally “own” with Bitcoin? A short introduction to krypto-property
#12Re: What do you legally “own” with Bitcoin? A short introduction to krypto-property
#13What does "Is that legal" actually _mean_ in this context? It's clearly not _illegal_ for me to own a private key. Bitcoin users generally accept that if they lose sole access to their keys, they lose sole access to their funds. It's an opt-in system. The fact that such opt-in systems may be rendered impossible due to the application of force is a tremendous flaw in the legal system; it's not otherwise an interesting…
Bitcoin users generally accept that if they lose sole access to their keys, they lose sole control of their funds, but not ownership.
For example, if I (for whatever reason) put a private key on a sheet of paper on my desk, and somebody sees that key, then I have lost effective control of that cryptocurrency, but not ownership; if that person would use that knowledge to deprive me of that currency, I would be entitled to have the court send angry armed men to extract compensation for that. It's quite comparable to the scenario where I have gold coins on my desk, and someone manages to take them - they have gained control of the coins, the physical reality enforces a rule where whoever holds the coins can hand them to others in exchange for goods and services (just as mathematical reality enforces a rule where whoever knows the private key can authorize Bitcoin transactions), but gaining control does not necessarily imply gaining ownership. Just as if a rich man gives their accountant the access codes to their electronic banking, and the keys to their safe, it does not mean that the accountant is legally free to do whatever they want with that money (even in the absence of a specific contract) - they have been given control, but not the ownership.
And, of course, simply using Bitcoin does not constitute opting out of the common property rights. You could opt out by a specific contract, but simply being aware "that if they lose sole access to their keys, they lose sole access to their funds" does not mean waiving your legal rights for redress if your funds get taken (though it might be difficult to find the culprit), just as being aware of all the risks involved by drunkenly waving around a bag with gold coins in a seedy alley does not mean waiving your rights for redress if these coins get taken.
Re: What do you legally “own” with Bitcoin? A short introduction to krypto-property
#14This looks a lot like bearer-bonds to me. Anyone knowing ("bearing") the key and having the means to use it is effectively the owner, except that ownership can be copied because digital. Pretty dangerous... Perhaps the legal response here should be dismissal.
It may technically have similar properties as bearer assets, but legally it's different. A bearer instrument is a document which is an explicit legal contract granting certain legal rights. A Bitcoin private key is not a document or a contract (an implicit contract as in "the system works this way, you can look at the description and everybody should know that" doesn't count), it's just some numbers, so it does not fulfil the criteria of laws about bearer assets. And if it did match these criteria, that would not be a good thing, since there are all kinds of prohibitions and restrictions on bearer assets due to their potential usage in money laundering. So while it is very similar to bearer assets regarding de facto control, it's not similar to bearer assets regarding de jure ownership.
Re: What do you legally “own” with Bitcoin? A short introduction to krypto-property
#15This looks a lot like bearer-bonds to me. Anyone knowing ("bearing") the key and having the means to use it is effectively the owner, except that ownership can be copied because digital. Pretty dangerous... Perhaps the legal response here should be dismissal.
The lawyer in this article asserts that "Bitcoin is most assuredly not a bearer asset or chattel, though." It may technically have similar properties as bearer assets, but legally it's different. A bearer instrument is a document which is an explicit legal contract granting certain legal rights. A Bitcoin private key is not a document or a contract (an implicit contract as in "the system works this way, you can look…
Has this been tested in court? Lawyers say all kinds of things, but the set of proven-correct things they say is smaller than the set of all things they say.
Re: What do you legally “own” with Bitcoin? A short introduction to krypto-property
#16This looks a lot like bearer-bonds to me. Anyone knowing ("bearing") the key and having the means to use it is effectively the owner, except that ownership can be copied because digital. Pretty dangerous... Perhaps the legal response here should be dismissal.
Re: What do you legally “own” with Bitcoin? A short introduction to krypto-property
#17Earlier quoted context omitted.
The lawyer in this article asserts that "Bitcoin is most assuredly not a bearer asset or chattel, though." It may technically have similar properties as bearer assets, but legally it's different. A bearer instrument is a document which is an explicit legal contract granting certain legal rights. A Bitcoin private key is not a document or a contract (an implicit contract as in "the system works this way, you can look…
> The lawyer in this article asserts that Has this been tested in court? Lawyers say all kinds of things, but the set of proven-correct things they say is smaller than the set of all things they say.
Re: What do you legally “own” with Bitcoin? A short introduction to krypto-property
#18Earlier quoted context omitted.
Following the context set by article, it's worth noting that it would be far more accurate to not use the word "owned" in your sentence - you could say such UTXOs are controlled by multiple people without explicitly sharing the key, two parties can acquire control independently, but, as the article describes, that's not exactly the same as the legal concept of ownership.
Bingo. This is the sort of scenario for which the courts don't currently have rules to decide to whom the coins (qua krypto-property) should belong.
The construction was specifically designed such that the person who figures out the hash collision is the owner.
The courts having rules to decide whom the coins belong is meaningless in that context.
Who owns a Barbie doll? Is it Mummy, Daddy or the child? It's not a matter for courts to decide because the question is meaningless.
Re: What do you legally “own” with Bitcoin? A short introduction to krypto-property
#19That’s it! Ownership, like its suggested by the lawyer...well like all things in law: “it depends” and what it depends on are the facts as applied to ownership laws of local jurisdiction
Re: What do you legally “own” with Bitcoin? A short introduction to krypto-property
#20Earlier quoted context omitted.
Bingo. This is the sort of scenario for which the courts don't currently have rules to decide to whom the coins (qua krypto-property) should belong.
The entire point of such a transaction is that the courts _do not_ decide it. The construction was specifically designed such that the person who figures out the hash collision is the owner. The courts having rules to decide whom the coins belong is meaningless in that context. Who owns a Barbie doll? Is it Mummy, Daddy or the child? It's not a matter for courts to decide because the question is meaningless.
Anything is a matter for the courts to decide. Look up Popov v. Hayashi, where the courts tried to sort out who owned the ball that was Barry Bonds' 73rd home run. 2 guys caught it at more or less the same time. There was a dispute. The courts applied equitable principles to determine how ownership should be divided. The day will come when someone needs to make a similar call in relation to BTC.