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Re: undefined

#11

Post by throwawayXH3eol »

threeseed wrote: post #4

There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic. And there are countless real world examples in particular within business and politics which support the conclusions of the research. Simply that quotas work and encouragement doesn't. So thank you anonymous guy for trying to prove the opposite with no facts or evidence. And maybe in a century or so when we have eradicated systemic sexism…

> There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic

I'm very much interested in reading about this. I'd be very thankful if you were to provide a few references :)

Re: undefined

#12

Post by raxxorrax »

threeseed wrote: post #4

There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic. And there are countless real world examples in particular within business and politics which support the conclusions of the research. Simply that quotas work and encouragement doesn't. So thank you anonymous guy for trying to prove the opposite with no facts or evidence. And maybe in a century or so when we have eradicated systemic sexism…

quotas don't really work and are injust. You don't even know the condition for success, so I doubt there could exists data that would support your assumption in any way.

Re: undefined

#13

Post by threeseed »

dr_teh wrote: post #9
threeseed wrote: post #4

There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic. And there are countless real world examples in particular within business and politics which support the conclusions of the research. Simply that quotas work and encouragement doesn't. So thank you anonymous guy for trying to prove the opposite with no facts or evidence. And maybe in a century or so when we have eradicated systemic sexism…

The onus is on you to prove that quotas outperform skill-based hiring. Sorry, but d'uh.

That's the beauty of having a large sample size. There are examples everywhere.

Look at political parties which imposed forms of quotas e.g. UK and Australian Labour. They have extremely high levels of female MPs versus alternative parties. Or look at corporate boards and executives across many countries. Almost all have seen improvements in female participation:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_representation_on_corpo...

Re: undefined

#14

Post by thrower123 »

That's the insidious part of affirmative action. It casts shade on even those who are legitimately good enough to succeed without it.

Re: undefined

#15

Post by arethuza »

dr_teh wrote: post #9
threeseed wrote: post #4

There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic. And there are countless real world examples in particular within business and politics which support the conclusions of the research. Simply that quotas work and encouragement doesn't. So thank you anonymous guy for trying to prove the opposite with no facts or evidence. And maybe in a century or so when we have eradicated systemic sexism…

The onus is on you to prove that quotas outperform skill-based hiring. Sorry, but d'uh.

Meanwhile in other threads we often discuss how the hiring process is broken for technical positions - what makes us think that hiring in other fields is any better?

Re: undefined

#16

Post by klohto »

threeseed wrote: post #4

There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic. And there are countless real world examples in particular within business and politics which support the conclusions of the research. Simply that quotas work and encouragement doesn't. So thank you anonymous guy for trying to prove the opposite with no facts or evidence. And maybe in a century or so when we have eradicated systemic sexism…

> trying to prove the opposite with no facts or evidence

You're doing exactly the same. You have provided no evidence or facts.

> There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic

Great, so provide it.

Re: undefined

#17

Post by k___ »

zimablue wrote: post #7
threeseed wrote: post #4

There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic. And there are countless real world examples in particular within business and politics which support the conclusions of the research. Simply that quotas work and encouragement doesn't. So thank you anonymous guy for trying to prove the opposite with no facts or evidence. And maybe in a century or so when we have eradicated systemic sexism…

"Works" according to what definition of working? Works to create a gender balance that you assume a priori is "correct" with any deviation being down to evil discrimination? Or do you have some more interesting definition?

A cursory google search that took 30 seconds.

FT: Diversity bring boost to profitability: https://www.ft.com/content/1bc22040-1302-11e7-80f4-13e067d50...

McKinsey: Why Diversity Matters https://www.mckinsey.com/business-functions/organization/our...

Academic paper based on multiple case studies: https://www.emeraldinsight.com/doi/full/10.1108/SHR-10-2017-...

It is head-smackingly obvious that a wide variety of experiences at senior management level leads to broader market fit, which leads to better products, which leads to larger number of sales targets which leads to greater profitability and growth and has the side effect of reducing HR complaints, increasing inclusivity and making work more enjoyable for everyone.

Re: undefined

#18

Post by antientropic »

threeseed wrote: post #13
dr_teh wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The onus is on you to prove that quotas outperform skill-based hiring. Sorry, but d'uh.

That's the beauty of having a large sample size. There are examples everywhere. Look at political parties which imposed forms of quotas e.g. UK and Australian Labour. They have extremely high levels of female MPs versus alternative parties. Or look at corporate boards and executives across many countries. Almost all have seen improvements in female participation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_representation_on…

Isn't that pretty much tautological? Yes, if you impose gender quota, then you're obviously going to get more women. The empirical question is whether the organization is better off as a result.

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#19

Post by dekken_ »

threeseed wrote: post #4

There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic. And there are countless real world examples in particular within business and politics which support the conclusions of the research. Simply that quotas work and encouragement doesn't. So thank you anonymous guy for trying to prove the opposite with no facts or evidence. And maybe in a century or so when we have eradicated systemic sexism…

Quotas are the definition of discrimination

Re: undefined

#20

Post by threeseed »

klohto wrote: post #16
threeseed wrote: post #4

There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic. And there are countless real world examples in particular within business and politics which support the conclusions of the research. Simply that quotas work and encouragement doesn't. So thank you anonymous guy for trying to prove the opposite with no facts or evidence. And maybe in a century or so when we have eradicated systemic sexism…

> trying to prove the opposite with no facts or evidence You're doing exactly the same. You have provided no evidence or facts. > There has been a staggering amount of research over the decades on this topic Great, so provide it.

> https://aicd.companydirectors.com.au/membership/the-boardroo...

Since introduction of quotas, Italy saw women's representation soar from 8% to 32%, France from 21% to 38% and on average the world saw a growth of 5% from 2012 to 2015.

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_government#Quotas

Of the top-ranked 20 countries in terms of female representation in government, 17 of these countries utilize some sort of quota system to ensure female inclusion.

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