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Italy’s olive crisis intensifies as deadly tree disease spreads

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Re: Italy’s olive crisis intensifies as deadly tree disease spreads

#191

Post by Regardsyjc »

agumonkey wrote: post #184
chicob wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The irrigation controls have a direct and significant impact in yield. Other tools raise profitability by contributing to greater efficacy and less waste. The pH meter, for example, pretty much payed itself the first time it was used.

I'm asking because I was interested in reviving (at my scale) farming on my mother's caribbean island. Lots of space, sun and rain, but farming is still seen as a burden (remains of colonialism organization). I think there's a lot of things to be improved to make it both simpler, greener (ketone was used for decades there). Ultimately to give people back the amazing vegetables that grow there naturally and avoid impo…

There are organizations out there like the Puerto Rico Resilience Fund. Maybe they might be able to help/know someone. I read an article that sounds like they have a great solidarity network.

Re: Italy’s olive crisis intensifies as deadly tree disease spreads

#192

Post by techopoly »

chicob wrote: post #23

I'm an olive and almond producer in Portugal. In preparation for this very serious issue, since that the only thing I can do is to minimize the risk of infection, I tell all personnel to spray bleach on trimming scissors for each tree, the case of high density orchards, and for every 10-15 trees (or each row) in super high density orchards. I also try to monitor for infection vectors like Cicadellidae, and for possib…

I know next to nothing in this area, but what is the possibility of grafting non-susceptible varietals onto the olive trees? I know that worked for France back when they grafted Texan vines onto their own during the grape phylloxera epidemic - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_French_Wine_Blight

Re: Italy’s olive crisis intensifies as deadly tree disease spreads

#193

Post by LastZactionHero »

btilly wrote: post #70
vanderZwan wrote: post #53

People outside of Italy are probably not aware of how seriously they take the topic of olive oil over there. The label "extra vergine" increases the price so much that there is a huge economic incentive for fraud. To combat this they have a taste police (literally) that checks that olive oil samples are not secretly mixes of fresh and old oil together. They are... quite opinionated, as you can see this exchange from…

To that I'd suggest reading https://lifehacker.com/the-most-and-least-fake-extra-virgin-... . Since then I've bought California olive oil and giggled at all of the Italian brands. About the article, my honest first thought was, "Does it matter? They already weren't selling olive oil in the first place, now they just have to pretend harder."

I thought the same thing. When I buy "olive oil", I just think of it more as a style than a product actually made from olives. I don't think an olive tree crisis will have an impact on whatever I'm buying.

Re: Italy’s olive crisis intensifies as deadly tree disease spreads

#194

Post by illegalsmile »

protonfish wrote: post #108
btilly wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To that I'd suggest reading https://lifehacker.com/the-most-and-least-fake-extra-virgin-... . Since then I've bought California olive oil and giggled at all of the Italian brands. About the article, my honest first thought was, "Does it matter? They already weren't selling olive oil in the first place, now they just have to pretend harder."

After I read about what passes for extra-virgin olive oil in the US I decided to try and get my hands on some domestic certified extra-virgin: I was blown away. I won't buy anything else now (not because of an article but because of the flavor.) It wouldn't surprise me if a lot of the cheap stuff found in grocery stores is just canola oil and green food coloring.

I do the same as you're essentially guaranteed the pressed on date and a much fresher product than what's available at any shop sort of a dedicated oil store. A lot of what actually has a pressed on date labeled at the store currently is November 2017 harvest and with some 2016 harvests thrown in too! You can now order 2018 pressed oil if you go direct for the freshest product available.

Re: Italy’s olive crisis intensifies as deadly tree disease spreads

#195

Post by sizzle »

anon2775 wrote: post #134
sizzle wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are there any sensors you can use to monitor health of trees programmatically? "These plant defenses do not seem to hinder the movement of X. fastidiosa. Occlusion of vascular tissue, while a normal plant response to infection, makes symptoms significantly worse: as the bacteria itself also reduces vascular function, a 90% reduction of vascular hydraulic function was seen in susceptible Vitis vinifera." Some type of…

That wouldn't scale because of the range and topology of BLE. Solar-powered micropower 900 MHz modules with built-in microcontrollers would be a basis for a viable solution. 900 MHz carries much further for a given power and isn't as susceptible to attenuation due to foilage. Source: did industrial 900 MHz and 2.4 GHz module testing, once upon a time.

Very cool, thanks for the info!

Re: Italy’s olive crisis intensifies as deadly tree disease spreads

#197

Post by vanderZwan »

vanderZwan wrote: post #156
rocketred wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

fun little presentation about it: https://suli.pppl.gov/2018/thursdays/The%20Emerging%20Field%...

Ah, I feel a bit dumb for not realizing what kind of applications these would be, because I really should know better: back in 2002, when I still tried studying physics, I was part of a committee that organized a student symposium on biomedical technology. One of the speakers was Eva Stoffels, who had recently invented a low-energy plasma needle. Believe it or not, she claimed her motivation was ridding the world of…

> bacteria are killed off really quickly by them because they lack a cell wall, without destroying human cells.

CORRECTION: I mixed up my terminology here. Bacteria have a cell wall (as do plants), human cells have a cell membrane[0][1]. But our cell membrane, as well as the cell wall of plant cells, are better at keeping the plasma ions out than the bacterial cell wall. In fact, the reason high plasma doses trigger apoptosis is because we actually use plasma ions as a cellular communication channel, IIRC. Would be hard to do that if our cells weren't protected against free plasma ions, right?

So the point still stands that bacteria die from plasma ion bombardment at doses that are harmless to human and plant cells.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cell_wall#Bacterial_cell_walls

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cell_membrane

Re: Italy’s olive crisis intensifies as deadly tree disease spreads

#198

Post by vanderZwan »

chicob wrote: post #128
vanderZwan wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There are even some Plasma Physics applications to agriculture, so the interdisciplinarity never ends! You can't just casually mention this without further explanation! :D

Here it is: http://spectrum.ieee.org/tech-talk/energy/environment/a-blas...

Thanks, finally got around to reading it!

> In explaining the results, Koga says that the plasma treatment speeds up the cell cycle so that the plant and seeds grow faster overall, with reactive oxygen species playing a key role in the effects.

Very cool! :)

> Nevertheless, Edward Bormashenko, professor of chemical engineering and biotechnology at Ariel University in Israel, says the situation was “more complicated than these results might indicate.” Pointing to his own team’s plasma research using seeds of lentils, beans, and wheat, he says: “There is no general approach available yet that can be applied to different kinds of seeds. Much depends on the types of seeds used, the conditions under which they geminate, and other factors.”

That is really cool, but I immediately have a follow-up question: given that plants also rely on a healthy soil ecosystem, which means symbiotic bacteria, and that this plasma treatment definitely will kill any trace bacteria on the skins of these cells, has it been explored if this has any effect?

Kind of like how you read all these stories of how the increase in C-sections results in a loss of transfer of healthy symbiotic bacteria from the mother to the child.

Re: Italy’s olive crisis intensifies as deadly tree disease spreads

#199

Post by chicob »

techopoly wrote: post #192
chicob wrote: post #23

I'm an olive and almond producer in Portugal. In preparation for this very serious issue, since that the only thing I can do is to minimize the risk of infection, I tell all personnel to spray bleach on trimming scissors for each tree, the case of high density orchards, and for every 10-15 trees (or each row) in super high density orchards. I also try to monitor for infection vectors like Cicadellidae, and for possib…

I know next to nothing in this area, but what is the possibility of grafting non-susceptible varietals onto the olive trees? I know that worked for France back when they grafted Texan vines onto their own during the grape phylloxera epidemic - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_French_Wine_Blight

There are no known cultivars of olive that are resistant to X. fastidiosa.

Phylloxera attacks the root, and so grafting with resistant stocks protects the scion.

In the case of X. fastidiosa, the bacteria can spread on the whole adult structures of the plant when infected vectors feed on the xylem, so grafting is not a solution.

In Portugal, Phylloxera became a synonym for madness, since the losses were colossal. I fear that Xylella fastidiosa might become the next "madness"...

Re: Italy’s olive crisis intensifies as deadly tree disease spreads

#200

Post by vanderZwan »

Gatsky wrote: post #141
giardini wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

docbrown says> "there is a very serious distinct taste difference between cheap and legitimate olive oil." Is there a taste/test that someone like me, who is a neophyte and definitely not an expert, could distinguish/use?

If you can find a way, try at least once to taste freshly pressed olive oil (by fresh I mean you are standing next to the oil press). This way you know for sure it hasn’t been blended or tampered with. My grandparents would pick olives and press them. We would toast big loaves of bread on the coals and drench them in this fresh oil. It tastes totally different to what you can buy in the store (at least what I have ha…

> It tastes totally different to what you can buy in the store (at least what I have had), or even how it tastes a week later.

Weirdly enough that reminds me of colostrum, or first milk:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colostrum

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