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No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

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Re: No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

#161

Post by Brockenstein »

icedchai wrote: post #110
ceejayoz wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Barring time travel, I'm not sure how a stock market correction starting in September 2018 can cause a Bitcoin crash starting in December 2017.

He's probably talking about the most recent drop. BTW, what bitcoin crash? I'm still up over 2000% ... /s

Obviously he's referring to the current value compared to the high last year. You know where the current price of bitcoin is over 75% less than it was last year...

Any time something loses 75% of it's value (and still dropping) and you say, "what crash?", you're not fooling anyone but yourself. Even if you got into bitcoin on day one.

Re: No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

#162

Post by simias »

Hermel wrote: post #93
scient wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, KYC/AML is totally bad because of trying to actually prevent money being funnelled into crime organization etc. This is why I cant stand ignorant crypto-fans.

Even according to the IRS's own estimates, laws like Fatca would never pass a cost/benefit test. The implementation costs of such bureaucratic monstrosities is in the range of hundreds of billions, whereas the benefit is a few orders of magnitude lower. The established banks do not complain much about it because the high fixed cost of compliance disproportionally affects small firms, thereby protecting them from bein…

So I know next to nothing about these regulations but what do you mean by "cost/benefit" exactly? Surely if these rules are meant to fight (directly or indirectly) organized crime then you can't just judge them on the amount of money saved? If you spend $10 millions to prevent $1 million to reach a terrorist organization, can't you consider it money well spent?

Re: No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

#163

Post by brohee »

Hermel wrote: post #93
scient wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, KYC/AML is totally bad because of trying to actually prevent money being funnelled into crime organization etc. This is why I cant stand ignorant crypto-fans.

Even according to the IRS's own estimates, laws like Fatca would never pass a cost/benefit test. The implementation costs of such bureaucratic monstrosities is in the range of hundreds of billions, whereas the benefit is a few orders of magnitude lower. The established banks do not complain much about it because the high fixed cost of compliance disproportionally affects small firms, thereby protecting them from bein…

Do you have a source for your hundreds of billions (hundreds of billions what?). Compliance costs are usually baked in personnel and IT costs.

Re: No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

#164

Post by jackjackk0 »

simias wrote: post #20

Since the article states "the trigger for the latest sell-off is unclear" I'm really curious if somebody here could venture a guess about the reasons for the sudden drop. The Bitcoin Cash fork seems suspiciously correlated but is it big enough news to cause such a turmoil? Being a cryptocurrency-skeptic I won't pretend that I don't experience a little bit of schadenfreude when I see CC crash, however if I'm trying to…

I like to think it's because of this article:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41558-018-0321-8

Re: No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

#165

Post by [deleted] »

simias wrote: post #20

Since the article states "the trigger for the latest sell-off is unclear" I'm really curious if somebody here could venture a guess about the reasons for the sudden drop. The Bitcoin Cash fork seems suspiciously correlated but is it big enough news to cause such a turmoil? Being a cryptocurrency-skeptic I won't pretend that I don't experience a little bit of schadenfreude when I see CC crash, however if I'm trying to…

[deleted]

Re: No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

#166

Post by icedchai »

ceejayoz wrote: post #146
icedchai wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He's probably talking about the most recent drop. BTW, what bitcoin crash? I'm still up over 2000% ... /s

> BTW, what bitcoin crash? I'm still up over 2000% ... An individual's stocks being up during a recession doesn't mean there's no recession, does it?

Sorry, I know that sarcasm can be difficult to detect in writing.

Re: No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

#167

Post by fweespeech »

scient wrote: post #74
superkuh wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is also the result of the federal governments of the world, the US in particular, choking off all the fiat crypto exchanges with their expanded and draconian know your customer laws. As an anecdote, I didn't buy my monthly bitcoin purchase early this month because I've been (and still am) locked out of my ~5 year old coinbase account I use constantly because they are being required to require new forms of ID and…

Yeah, KYC/AML is totally bad because of trying to actually prevent money being funnelled into crime organization etc. This is why I cant stand ignorant crypto-fans.

A) Large criminal organizations bypass KYC/AML/ABC just fine.

B) Low-level crooks and privacy minded folks are the ones that get caught.

C) Cost of compliance with KYC/AML/ABC is greater than the money recovered.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/francescoppola/2018/09/30/the-b...

> In that connection, a senior employee from the correspondent bank in question assessed that out of ten non-resident customers from the Estonian branch, the correspondent bank would be comfortable only with servicing one given the customers’ characteristics. The employee also warned Danske Bank against Moldovan customers and customers transferring money to Moldova.

Criminal organizations just mule the cash to a friendly bank. Then things proceed accordingly and the correspondent banks will blindly play along for years.

The end goal of these things are not what is sold in PR-speak. It is about expanding the surveillance state for TIA purposes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_Information_Awareness#/m...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_Information_Awareness

There is a reason they renamed this the "Terrorism Information Awareness" center and then "shut it down". But, of course, other agencies just quietly use the software instead with some superficial changes.

If you think any of these ever really get "shut down" because overreach or the like...yeah. They don't. They just re-named, classified, and better hidden in some intelligence agency's toolbox.

You shouldn't trust the labels on laws.

Re: No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

#168

Post by jasonwen »

simias wrote: post #20

Since the article states "the trigger for the latest sell-off is unclear" I'm really curious if somebody here could venture a guess about the reasons for the sudden drop. The Bitcoin Cash fork seems suspiciously correlated but is it big enough news to cause such a turmoil? Being a cryptocurrency-skeptic I won't pretend that I don't experience a little bit of schadenfreude when I see CC crash, however if I'm trying to…

I discussed the things that happened specifically on November 14th in my Quora answer: https://www.quora.com/Why-did-the-price-of-Bitcoin-plummet-d...

It's very very likely because of the Bitcoin Cash fork. It has become a pissing contest between Roger Ver (Bitcoin ABC) and Craig Wright (Bitcoin SV). While Craig trolls and threatens the Bitcoin ABC side by "bleeding them dry" in a hash war.

Jihan Wu, founder of Bitmain quoted: “I have no intention to start a hash war with Craig, because if I do, by relocating hash power from BTC mining to BCH mining - BTC price will dump below yearly support; it may even breach $5,000. But since Craig is relentless, I am all in to fight till death!

The war is related to Bitcoin as the price of Bitcoin tanks because in a hashing war, both sides are likely to rent hash from the Bitcoin mining pool. This is being settled in Bitcoin, sold on the market to cover electricity, and thus suppressing the price of Bitcoin.

Since Craig is trolling around, threatening a price of $1,000 per Bitcoin in a full out hash war, people are selling before it gets even more ugly.

Another downside which reinforces the price suppression is for Proof-of-Work systems (where miners are rewarded based on their computing power), there's an unfortunate feedback loop in price drops. As said by Colin, founder of Nano currency, Low price -> low mining rewards -> turn off some miners to lower cost -> lower hash rate -> longer transaction confirmation -> lower price.

More details can be found in my Quora answer about this.

Re: No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

#169

Post by simias »

superkuh wrote: post #66
jeletonskelly wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trading volume has dropped significantly over the last 6 months. Large holders have been patient waiting for new money to enter the market. Eventually, when the only activity is a few automated traders and the exchange liquidity provider, large holders are faced with opportunity costs of investing in something else and the limited liquidity the market can absorb as they exit. It's a domino effect as they see each oth…

This is also the result of the federal governments of the world, the US in particular, choking off all the fiat crypto exchanges with their expanded and draconian know your customer laws. As an anecdote, I didn't buy my monthly bitcoin purchase early this month because I've been (and still am) locked out of my ~5 year old coinbase account I use constantly because they are being required to require new forms of ID and…

Ignoring the debate about whether these regulations are a good or a bad thing, don't you think that the fact that "the federal governments of the world" (not sure what you meant exactly by that) are capable of chocking exchanges and harming cryptocurrencies in the process prove that the dream of a decentralized, unregulated currency is out of reach?

Even though the bitcoin network itself is censorship-resistant clearly you're having issues at the interface with the real world. Doesn't that negate a lot of what made CC attractive in the first place?

Re: No End in Sight for Crypto Sell-Off as Bitcoin Breaches $4,250

#170

Post by wickoff »

Danieru wrote: post #82

The price has been bouncing off the 6k magic "resistence" for ages now. Each bounce reaching lower and lower highs. It was only a matter of time before the that energy disapated. Technical analysis of stocks and efficient markets is a fool's tool, but BTC is fool's money so TA is an efficient tool. Yes, I did explain this prediction half a year back to my BTC holding friends. As you can imagine; they ignored the advi…

TA works well in traditional markets too. Good crypto traders who have never owned a stock in their entire life have no issues transitioning.

https://twitter.com/CryptoDonAlt/status/1064585203237167106

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