I'd take a little belt tightening over the youth unemployment Greece or Spain has any day.
In Greece and Spain, the youth unemployment goes hand to hand with the belt tightening.
UK austerity has inflicted 'great misery' on citizens, UN says
21–30 of 105 posts
Re: UK austerity has inflicted 'great misery' on citizens, UN says
#22I'd take a little belt tightening over the youth unemployment Greece or Spain has any day.
I might give this argument a little more credence had the ”little belt tightening” measures not been so transparently politically motivated wealth transfers from the poor to the rich. Funny how ”belt tightening” always applies to the least powerful.
Re: UK austerity has inflicted 'great misery' on citizens, UN says
#23Earlier quoted context omitted.
>It didn't have to happen that way, it was a deliberate choice. What was the other choice? ECB printing money and lending it to Greece fully knowing it will be never paid back?
The other choice was to let the Greek govt default on its debts; there're almost 300billion reasons why Germany & France didn't want to do that...
Nothing stops Greek government from defaulting. Just miss your next coupon payment, and viola.
But once you default, you have to balance your budget, because nobody will lend to you, and until 2017 Greece were running a deficit. Default would cause even more pain than so much hated austerity.
Re: UK austerity has inflicted 'great misery' on citizens, UN says
#24Earlier quoted context omitted.
Aside from how terrible this kind of "there are worse things elsewhere" argument is in general, this isn't even a choice. Like, a little belt tightening trashed the Greek economy. Utterly wrecked it. Did more damage and for longer than the 2008 global financial crisis.
It was already wrecked and heading for a cliff. Austerity brings the cliff closer and reduces it's height. You'll notice the fall and blame austerity but it's better than the alternative.
Austerity stunts growth - it's only a short-term solution.
In your analogy, it only pushed the cliff further away. The cliff is still there, it's still as steep and still as high and we will still, inevitably, fall off it and suffer the consequences.
"We" (I'm Greek) as in those of us who haven't yet crashed- haven't yet been rendered homeless, or forced to live hand-to-mouth, supported by soup kitchens and community handouts and so on.
Re: UK austerity has inflicted 'great misery' on citizens, UN says
#25I'd take a little belt tightening over the youth unemployment Greece or Spain has any day.
Is that really the only choice? The UK is one of the richest countries in the world. Part of the reason for that is a long period of generally pro-business, economically conservative government. That's good in many ways, because in a modern economy, business and investment is needed to drive improvements in individual living standards. But doing that relies on a sensible long-term strategy that can be used to achieve…
"There is no point in cutting healthcare spending for preventative services, for example, if those cuts result in higher long-term costs. "
By that logic the government should simply increase spending 10x on disability and everything will be great!
Everything has an ROI, everything has an efficiency.
Canada and Germany both went through massive austerity in the 1990's to re-tool their economies from massive debt overhang - and it worked. Both Canada and Germany emerged on reasonable footing.
I think arguments should be less about spending and more about efficiencies.
Re: UK austerity has inflicted 'great misery' on citizens, UN says
#26Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is that really the only choice? The UK is one of the richest countries in the world. Part of the reason for that is a long period of generally pro-business, economically conservative government. That's good in many ways, because in a modern economy, business and investment is needed to drive improvements in individual living standards. But doing that relies on a sensible long-term strategy that can be used to achieve…
it's a real shame that the concept of raising certain taxes in the UK (specifically income tax and corporation tax) has become an anathema to british politicians. We still need to get the money from somewhere, so instead of fairly increasing progressive taxes, we get lots of little (often unfair) hidden tax rises and huge cuts in public spending. The weird part is, the british public go along with this. The Conservat…
> The weird part is, the British public go along with this.
I don't think they're 'going along with it' - you're making it sound like they don't know what they want.
UK society doesn't have much of an anti-government movement like in the US, but low taxation and leaner governance is a pretty common, mainstream preference here. I think if you speak to a diverse group of voters in the UK you will find a lot of support for austerity and low taxation.
It's not even a Conservative thing! See my sibling comment for an example.
The NHS is a strong outlier in people's preference for extra funding. Child education is another. But for social security? I think the appetite in the UK is less than you think it is.
Re: UK austerity has inflicted 'great misery' on citizens, UN says
#27Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is that really the only choice? The UK is one of the richest countries in the world. Part of the reason for that is a long period of generally pro-business, economically conservative government. That's good in many ways, because in a modern economy, business and investment is needed to drive improvements in individual living standards. But doing that relies on a sensible long-term strategy that can be used to achieve…
it's a real shame that the concept of raising certain taxes in the UK (specifically income tax and corporation tax) has become an anathema to british politicians. We still need to get the money from somewhere, so instead of fairly increasing progressive taxes, we get lots of little (often unfair) hidden tax rises and huge cuts in public spending. The weird part is, the british public go along with this. The Conservat…
My local (Labour, not that it really matters) council has taken pride in not raising council tax for the last 5+ years. Yet inflation has pushed up wages and expenses and somehow they expect to maintain the same quality of local government. Impossible!
Re: UK austerity has inflicted 'great misery' on citizens, UN says
#28I'd take a little belt tightening over the youth unemployment Greece or Spain has any day.
> I'd take a little belt tightening over North Korea or Somalia.
False dichotomy right there. Why not also include say, Sweden, France or Germany as more realistic comparisons?
Re: UK austerity has inflicted 'great misery' on citizens, UN says
#29Regardless of the actual story, which I do feel has merit, there are examples of why it is perilous to rely on one news source: "whose family couldn’t get school meals in Dumfries, Scotland, because of their immigration status" Actually they couldn't get free school meals, just like anyone else with a household income over £16k. A subtle omission but one that makes it sound like they were excluded from food entirely:…
Families below the income cut-off don't get fsm if they're working at all in Wales, not quite sure how that's supposed to work.
Re: UK austerity has inflicted 'great misery' on citizens, UN says
#30This report is so horribly biased. The "austerity" in question is a decline in spending as a proportion of GDP since 2009, NOT actual cuts. That's normal when recovering from a recession!