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‘I Don’t Really Want to Work for Facebook.’ Say Some Computer Science Students

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11–20 of 560 posts

Re: ‘I Don’t Really Want to Work for Facebook.’ Say Some Computer Science Students

#11

After Susan Fowler wrote her exposè on Uber's culture a couple years ago, many commented saying that they would have trouble attracting talent given their tarnished reputation. Did that ever happen in practice?

Sure, I think it is happening in practice.

With respect, I think you might be succumbing to a weak form of selection bias (perhaps theres a better bias at play). In my thinking, people who don't work at megacorps have issues with bringing technocratic dystopia into reality (either due to horrific cultural issues at these companies, or by turning humans into labor-machines, either internally, or via externally-developed markets) aren't taken seriously as "opposing voices" in the narrative. No one is debating the fact that you get cheap goods using these practices, but it certainly seems to have a negative effect on overall empathy/humanity, in my perhaps naive opinion.

To bring the point home, if you aren't at Google, Facebook, Amazon, or any of the other gigantic tech companies, you aren't considered part of the "talent pool" unless you have some kind of in, or just deal with the interview process and get one of the roles. I've noticed that because I haven't worked at a "real tech company" individuals at one of the larger Internet companies seem to discount what I have to say, with perhaps what you'd call 'pure tech'-adjacent software development experience at a large investment bank.

I think a huge number of talented people are choosing not to work at one of these firms, Uber as one example, specifically because of moral issues with one of the above issues mentioned.

Re: ‘I Don’t Really Want to Work for Facebook.’ Say Some Computer Science Students

#12

After Susan Fowler wrote her exposè on Uber's culture a couple years ago, many commented saying that they would have trouble attracting talent given their tarnished reputation. Did that ever happen in practice?

I recall a WaPo article about this last year*

Anecdotally, I know some developers who express disinterest in working for a company like Uber or Facebook. But it would be really difficult to gauge how many or the overall effect - except that over years, maybe, you would see their product suffer as they fail to attract and retain decent talent.

*https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/the-big-prob...

Re: ‘I Don’t Really Want to Work for Facebook.’ Say Some Computer Science Students

#13
post #7

On this topic: could someone tell me whatever happened since the "security incident" that they were "very sorry" for? Did they commit to making even a single tangible change to their coding practices to prevent millions of people's accounts from being hacked again? Or is it business, condolences, and hoping-the-wind-blows-past-quietly as usual?

Oh, you were supposed to have forgotten about that by now.

Never forget! I still do not have my "View as Public" option.

Re: ‘I Don’t Really Want to Work for Facebook.’ Say Some Computer Science Students

#14

After Susan Fowler wrote her exposè on Uber's culture a couple years ago, many commented saying that they would have trouble attracting talent given their tarnished reputation. Did that ever happen in practice?

Sure, I think it is happening in practice. With respect, I think you might be succumbing to a weak form of selection bias (perhaps theres a better bias at play). In my thinking, people who don't work at megacorps have issues with bringing technocratic dystopia into reality (either due to horrific cultural issues at these companies, or by turning humans into labor-machines, either internally, or via externally-develop…

I think you´re right. I certainly wouldn´t work for any of those companies, and have repeatedly turned down interview requests. Would not have had Google on that list up until a year ago, but am starting to feel glad I escaped there.

Re: ‘I Don’t Really Want to Work for Facebook.’ Say Some Computer Science Students

#15
post #9

> Ms. Brown said a lot of students criticize Facebook and talk about how they would not work there, but ultimately join. “Everyone cares about ethics in tech before they get a contract,” she said. This describes my what I've observed perfectly. There are very few companies that make new grad offers comparable to Facebook's, and career advancement opportunities and working conditions at Facebook tend to be better than…

I could see debt-laden recent grads compromising their ethics to work at FB.

I don't see myself (not debt-laden, have a great job) compromising mine just to work for them.

What's the long term effect of that trend? Will FB be chock full of juniors with an ever depleting number of seniors?

Re: ‘I Don’t Really Want to Work for Facebook.’ Say Some Computer Science Students

#17
post #7

On this topic: could someone tell me whatever happened since the "security incident" that they were "very sorry" for? Did they commit to making even a single tangible change to their coding practices to prevent millions of people's accounts from being hacked again? Or is it business, condolences, and hoping-the-wind-blows-past-quietly as usual?

Maybe all the recent news about facebook using misdirection is in and of itself misdirection to emotionally distract you from their technical failings.

Re: ‘I Don’t Really Want to Work for Facebook.’ Say Some Computer Science Students

#18
post #9

> Ms. Brown said a lot of students criticize Facebook and talk about how they would not work there, but ultimately join. “Everyone cares about ethics in tech before they get a contract,” she said. This describes my what I've observed perfectly. There are very few companies that make new grad offers comparable to Facebook's, and career advancement opportunities and working conditions at Facebook tend to be better than…

And I don’t blame them.

Developers are largely undercompensated for the utility they provide for firms, both across companies and within (compared to other roles).

In the Bay, it’s the difference between living comfortably+saving for their future and just making ends meet.

It’s a bit like blaming the scientists of the Manhattan Project for dropping the atomic bomb.

Re: ‘I Don’t Really Want to Work for Facebook.’ Say Some Computer Science Students

#19
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Blame HN's 80 character limit on titles.

Dropping "so" instead of "some" keeps the intent of the headline and still manages to stay under 80 characters.

... some comp-sci students say

Re: ‘I Don’t Really Want to Work for Facebook.’ Say Some Computer Science Students

#20
Yeah...I doubt that. Especially people attending hackathons. Underlying modern hackathon culture is a serious amount of careerism and showmanship. Most of the kids at hackathons would sacrifice a lot more than morals to get a job at Facebook.
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