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Ask HN: If I use GSuite does Google mine my data for their own purposes?

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Re: Ask HN: If I use GSuite does Google mine my data for their own purposes?

#21
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to pay for GSuite and still found my content being mined. With all due respect to Google, I find it hard to believe that they're as consistent as they believe with filtering paid vs free accounts across the service. I could be, and am open to being, wrong, though. I'm not Google. Just found myself with substantially less targeted advertising once I left. And actually that's slightly interesting - how does one…

> found my content being mined How?

OP indicated the reason for the conclusion - "...found myself with substantially less targeted advertising once I left"

Re: Ask HN: If I use GSuite does Google mine my data for their own purposes?

#22
I don’t belive they scan the contents of your documents/emails, but I do beleive they use metadata and behavior.

I’m conflicted because part of me thinks using their paid services encourages them to pursue a more Apple-link business model where advertising dollars are not the end goal, but it just doesn’t seem to be their mission at all.

Re: Ask HN: If I use GSuite does Google mine my data for their own purposes?

#23

I believe Google is a surveillance company, and I like to think that anything they do has something to do with that. I would love someone to prove me wrong though, because what they're doing is so dystopian.

As another reply notes, this is a very strange burden of proof you're suggesting. That said...

I don't think modeling Google as a surveillance company is a particularly good model. If you need to pick something reductionist, it's probably safest to model Google as a corporation that seeks to make money, although that's not particularly unique or (obviously) a sufficiently refined model.

I use a lot of Google services, own some Google hardware (phone, smart speakers and the like). But I also have reservations and concerns about Google, and I try to regularly reexamine my relationship with Google to see if I'm still comfortable with everything!

One step I took was to really dig into the My Activity dashboard that Google provides. I was really interested, after letting a Google Home into my life, to see what I could learn. The most obvious step I took was to listen to the recordings Google keeps of every interaction I have with the Home, and ensure there weren't things presented that I hadn't intended Google to be listening to.

But! What if Google is actually recording everything, and then only presenting me with the things that were actual instructions to my Google Home in the dashboard? (Let's disregard network traffic analysis and the like for the moment.) If Google were up to this kind of shenanigans, they would have to be very, very careful to have an appropriately conservative filter in place to ensure none of the secret recordings were ever presented to me.

So, to test this, I proceeded to independently record every interaction I had with the Google Home (just took a quick note on paper) for a couple days. I later went to the My Activity dashboard to see if every interaction was present. (They were.) At this point, I am reduced to a narrower set of options: Google is actually doing what they told me they would, or their super-AI is so advanced that is is capable of covert monitoring and reporting on my activity along with _perfect_ filtering such that there are no false positives or false negatives.

This obviously isn't exhaustive or comprehensive. But I find myself coming back to "why?" The things that Google tells me they do with my data, up front, are sufficient to explain their business activities and revenues. The disincentives around doing anything more nefarious are rather large. I reevaluate the relationship periodically, but I am generally comfortable looking at the terms of the deal (I share some data, they provide me a lot of value) and accepting them.

Honestly, the thing I find far scarier is their absolute shit-tier support and draconian account suspension policies. I found myself entertaining becoming a Google One subscriber even though I have no need for more cloud storage. I was literally entertaining the notion of paying them a nominal fee every month so that I might be somewhat less likely to lose my account and all of the association information for some minor (possibly merely perceived) transgression. That's a bit scary!

Re: Ask HN: If I use GSuite does Google mine my data for their own purposes?

#24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> would love someone to prove me wrong though The burden of proof lies on the person making claims. I'm not asserting that your claims are wrong, but if you want people to take your statements seriously you need to provide proof. In order to practice what I teach, here's an article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burden_of_proof_(philosophy) . EDIT: Fixed paragraph formatting

I mean, it's literally no secret that Google collects user information, contents of emails, browsing history, etc and uses it to target advertisements to users. If you use a google product or service for more than 5 minutes, you literally see it happening.

OK, I guess that depends on how you define surveillance. I think of surveillance as having some kind of relation to the state, for example a private investigator looking into a court matter, a company sharing information with the government (outside of warrants), etc. If we're taking surveillance to mean general tracking, then yes the OP's statement probably doesn't need further evidence.

Re: Ask HN: If I use GSuite does Google mine my data for their own purposes?

#25
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The specificity of "for advertising purposes" leaves wide open the likelihood that it is scanned for "their own purposes", per the question that was asked.

Or for the purposes of, “spam filtering, virus detection, spellcheck and the ability to search for emails and files…”, which seems reasonable and fair.

Listing multiple items does not exclude others.

Re: Ask HN: If I use GSuite does Google mine my data for their own purposes?

#26
Anecdotally, a couple of weeks ago I made a "budget" spreadsheet in google sheets and since then I've been getting the same youtube ad for a money management app, over and over again. I hadn't seen the ad before and the spreadsheet is the only change in my behaviour on google services that I can think of.

Re: Ask HN: If I use GSuite does Google mine my data for their own purposes?

#28
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to pay for GSuite and still found my content being mined. With all due respect to Google, I find it hard to believe that they're as consistent as they believe with filtering paid vs free accounts across the service. I could be, and am open to being, wrong, though. I'm not Google. Just found myself with substantially less targeted advertising once I left. And actually that's slightly interesting - how does one…

> found my content being mined How?

Besides what the parent already mentioned, I was also a paying GSuite user for some years (when it was still called Google Apps for Applications/Business). And I had e-mail contacts (Google Mail is covered by GApps) appear as suggested profiles, etc. in Google+ (then not covered by GApps).

Even if there is no malice, it seems that they are not enforcing strict boundaries between their products.

Re: Ask HN: If I use GSuite does Google mine my data for their own purposes?

#30
Google will capture your data whether you're a paying customer of not. They will tell you they capture "some data" to personalise their service and make your life more convenient. In reality, they capture everything they can and it's all grist to their advertising mill.

But Google is not the only company doing this. Facebook and Amazon will track you across the internet, and even Microsoft is now adopting similar strategies.

Your best defence is to minimise the attack surface. Own your own data by paying for cloud storage and email. Use a browser like Brave, or Firefox with the new privacy control turned on. Don't post anything to social media you wouldn't be happy for the whole world to know.

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