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Winds of Change: The Case for New Digital Currency

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Re: Winds of Change: The Case for New Digital Currency

#11

Post by randaouser »

_nalply wrote: post #6
hanniabu wrote: post #3

> cryptocurrencies seek to anchor trust in technology. So long as they are transparent.....Still, I am not entirely convinced. Proper regulation of these entities will remain a pillar of trust. I don't think they understand that the purpose of cryptocurrencies is to remove the need for trust. Trust in the math, not the banker. AKA the economy should be built off the monetary system rather than the monetary system bei…

There is still the need for trust... in the implementation of software! Even if you read the source code carefully and ocmpile the software yourself, you trust the compiler and the operating system to do the right thing.

No, you dont need to trust the software per say; there is a need to understand how software works in order to participate. That knowledge gap for most people will result in them trusting a 3rd party auditing of the software. You do much the same when you allowed your bank to share information with equifax... what happened there? One of many issues with trusting corps to do the right thing [EDIT: spelling]

Re: Winds of Change: The Case for New Digital Currency

#12

Post by randaouser »

PeterisP wrote: post #4
hanniabu wrote: post #3

> cryptocurrencies seek to anchor trust in technology. So long as they are transparent.....Still, I am not entirely convinced. Proper regulation of these entities will remain a pillar of trust. I don't think they understand that the purpose of cryptocurrencies is to remove the need for trust. Trust in the math, not the banker. AKA the economy should be built off the monetary system rather than the monetary system bei…

You can't remove the need for trust - that need is inherently beyond the reach of math. If I want to use money to pay for some goods, I need trust that I can get that money back if the goods won't arrive. Math alone can't provide that, it needs something extra, e.g. a trusted escrow service in the case of crypto. If I want to use money as a store of value, I need trust that the value is going to stay stable and maint…

>If I want to use money to pay for some goods, I need trust that I can get that money back if the goods won't arrive. Math alone can't provide that, it needs something extra, e.g. a trusted escrow service in the case of crypto.

No need for extras, you can do this today on Ethereum with Hashed Time Lock Contracts

Re: Winds of Change: The Case for New Digital Currency

#13

Post by emiliobumachar »

randaouser wrote: post #12
PeterisP wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't remove the need for trust - that need is inherently beyond the reach of math. If I want to use money to pay for some goods, I need trust that I can get that money back if the goods won't arrive. Math alone can't provide that, it needs something extra, e.g. a trusted escrow service in the case of crypto. If I want to use money as a store of value, I need trust that the value is going to stay stable and maint…

>If I want to use money to pay for some goods, I need trust that I can get that money back if the goods won't arrive. Math alone can't provide that, it needs something extra, e.g. a trusted escrow service in the case of crypto. No need for extras, you can do this today on Ethereum with Hashed Time Lock Contracts

Could you please expand on how does the Ethereum blockchain get to know whether the goods arrived if the buyer and seller are saying conflicting things and no third parties are involved?

Re: Winds of Change: The Case for New Digital Currency

#14

Post by divan »

This is suprisingly good and even refreshing speech after reading tons of very opinionated pro- and contra-crypto articles.

Financial system design still have this chicken or the egg problem – we need to design fintech systems aligned with offline social interaction patterns as much as possible, but their (current) design changes our social interaction patterns in return as well.

It's still fascinating to see how the world reimagines and reconsiders the nature of money. And not only in cryptopunks community, but in such a huge powerhouses as IMF as well.

Re: Winds of Change: The Case for New Digital Currency

#15

Post by corv »

randaouser wrote: post #12
PeterisP wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't remove the need for trust - that need is inherently beyond the reach of math. If I want to use money to pay for some goods, I need trust that I can get that money back if the goods won't arrive. Math alone can't provide that, it needs something extra, e.g. a trusted escrow service in the case of crypto. If I want to use money as a store of value, I need trust that the value is going to stay stable and maint…

>If I want to use money to pay for some goods, I need trust that I can get that money back if the goods won't arrive. Math alone can't provide that, it needs something extra, e.g. a trusted escrow service in the case of crypto. No need for extras, you can do this today on Ethereum with Hashed Time Lock Contracts

Bitcoin has HTLCs too...

Re: Winds of Change: The Case for New Digital Currency

#16

Post by hkt »

emiliobumachar wrote: post #13
randaouser wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>If I want to use money to pay for some goods, I need trust that I can get that money back if the goods won't arrive. Math alone can't provide that, it needs something extra, e.g. a trusted escrow service in the case of crypto. No need for extras, you can do this today on Ethereum with Hashed Time Lock Contracts

Could you please expand on how does the Ethereum blockchain get to know whether the goods arrived if the buyer and seller are saying conflicting things and no third parties are involved?

Of course he can't.

Re: Winds of Change: The Case for New Digital Currency

#18

Post by hkt »

I feel like one day, central banks are going to be attacked by private banks and the means of attack will be cryptocurrency. The aim will be to get rid of central bank deposits and seize control of the payments system - once the central bank deposits are gone and we're cashless, this will become easy. They could even base it offshore to avoid consumer protections. If we're lucky when this happens, it will be a test of the remaining power of nation states. If we're unlucky, they'll roll over as the most basic means of exchange is privatized.

Re: Winds of Change: The Case for New Digital Currency

#19

Post by RanInt1111 »

hkt wrote: post #18

I feel like one day, central banks are going to be attacked by private banks and the means of attack will be cryptocurrency. The aim will be to get rid of central bank deposits and seize control of the payments system - once the central bank deposits are gone and we're cashless, this will become easy. They could even base it offshore to avoid consumer protections. If we're lucky when this happens, it will be a test o…

Pardon the displeasure, but that sounds utterly naive. Sure, the elite that control ever more with every passing day are just going to accept a distributed financial system that threatens their ultimate goal, world domination by a neo-aristocratic master class that lords over the mixed master race of peasants they created through "diversity" and "equity"?

The far more likely scenario of the "cashless" society, aka, slavery, is that "laws" will be "passed" that make unapproved, aka, uncontrolled "currency" illegal. Your life and your worth will be nothing but a number on a screen, if you are worth anything at all once automation and robotics and AI make humans lose inherent value. There is no point in humans in a de-industrialized, post-human future of the master class served by robots and a few flesh servants.

Re: Winds of Change: The Case for New Digital Currency

#20

Post by nobody271 »

PeterisP wrote: post #4
hanniabu wrote: post #3

> cryptocurrencies seek to anchor trust in technology. So long as they are transparent.....Still, I am not entirely convinced. Proper regulation of these entities will remain a pillar of trust. I don't think they understand that the purpose of cryptocurrencies is to remove the need for trust. Trust in the math, not the banker. AKA the economy should be built off the monetary system rather than the monetary system bei…

You can't remove the need for trust - that need is inherently beyond the reach of math. If I want to use money to pay for some goods, I need trust that I can get that money back if the goods won't arrive. Math alone can't provide that, it needs something extra, e.g. a trusted escrow service in the case of crypto. If I want to use money as a store of value, I need trust that the value is going to stay stable and maint…

Well there are smart contracts which can act as an escrow service. I don't know how that works in reality, though. If smart contracts have to be deterministic how can they be used to guarantee that, say, a delivery was made? I want to belieber.
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