Since each city is only receiving half the benefit they thought they were bidding on, presumably they’ll each get to cut their bids in half — the subsidies, tax abatements, infrastructure spending promises, etc.? But I haven’t seen any notice of this in the news coverage.
Amazon expected to announce NYC and Northern Virginia as new headquarters
211–220 of 229 posts
Re: Amazon expected to announce NYC and Northern Virginia as new headquarters
#212Earlier quoted context omitted.
Most CEOs are rich enough to move. But they are also powerful enough to get the company to move to a location more convenient or appealing to them.
Sure, but he has lived in Seattle for a long time, what makes you think he wants to move to NYC? The office in NYC is going to be nothing more than a big satellite office compared to the huge HQ in Seattle, so it's not like he's actually moving Amazon's HQ and himself to NYC. In fact I doubt he'd spend that much time there. Given his duties, he'll probably be in Seattle most of the time. Also, I very much doubt the o…
I never said he wanted to move. And I agree he'll probably spend less time at the other offices. But that still doesn't mean it's a pure coincidence that the two new offices are exactly in locations which he liked enough to buy homes.
If the guy really didn't like DC, I'm thinking he wouldn't have bought a $23m home there. As you say, he's rich enough he can do what he wants.
Re: Amazon expected to announce NYC and Northern Virginia as new headquarters
#213Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is both arrogant and ignorant at the same time. New York, I'm sure, is a great city, but it is not the end all be all of everything. The next time you sit down at one of your fancy Manhattan restaurants I would encourage you to humbly thank the people from where there are "stripmalls" who made it and most other things in NYC possible. Food, the literal materials for the buildings, the energy renewable or otherwi…
Also the food in NYC is fine but not head and shoulders above other cities. Especially when you factor in the bill.
I think that food, on average, in NYC is worse than average.
There is so much foot traffic in the city that mediocre and bad restaurants can survive, even with high rents.
Don't get me wrong, NYC has some amazing food, but my experience has been pretty bad with most restaurants.
Re: Amazon expected to announce NYC and Northern Virginia as new headquarters
#214Earlier quoted context omitted.
Whoa. Bezos indeed has homes in NYC and Washington DC. (As well as Seattle, Beverly Hills, and a ranch in Texas. [1]) I can't find it now, but years ago The Economist ran an article about a study that said a key factor in corporate headquarter moves was where the CEO lives. Disappointing to see it play out like that on such a grand scale, and after such a pretense of a nationwide search. Yet another thing that convin…
You may be referring to William Whyte’s book City. It describes how reducing a CEO’s commute is one of the major factors in the corporate relocations he studied[1]. Joel Spolsky also wrote about this 15 years ago: > “My company, Fog Creek Software, is relocating. There’s nothing wrong with the brownstone we’re in, it’s just a tiringly long commute. Basically, we’re moving because of William Whyte‘s rule: virtually al…
Exactly it. Thanks!
Re: Amazon expected to announce NYC and Northern Virginia as new headquarters
#215Earlier quoted context omitted.
An SDE2 is a senior software engineer, typically one who's been with Amazon for a few years. It's unreasonable to assume most of the employees in the new office are going to be SDE2. Likely most of them will be new hires and SDE1. $200k total compensation is not competitive for an experienced senior software engineer in Manhattan. I bet one of the arguments against NYC was that Amazon would likely have to improve com…
An SDE 2 isn't really a senior software engineer role, that would be SDE3, where many of which make closer to 300k.
I'm not an expert on Amazon, but I do have friends working there, so I asked them.
They told me it's very rare for a new hire to come in as SDE3. Even a very experienced senior engineer is unlikely to get an offer above SDE2 level.
SDE3 is thus not just a senior engineer, but one who has been with Amazon for several years.
Per our discussion, that means very few of the new office employees are going to be above SDE2 level. The stated purpose of this office is to recruit new talent, which will be at SDE2 level at most.
Finally, "close to 300k" isn't very competitive for a senior NYC SWE who has been with the same company for years. I'm sure you know this is far below most other FAANGs for a similar position.
Re: Amazon expected to announce NYC and Northern Virginia as new headquarters
#216Hot take: none of these are headquarters. These are just big sattelite campuses that every company has. I will also predict that hiring in these offices will be far lower than projected, especially engineering hires
Very reasonable thought. I'd think Amazon is now expanding to level of IT consulting companies who send hordes of consultants to sell/implement pre packaged solutions of their own or third party.
This is not some SV level talent that Amazon will be looking for these positions. So I do not see why salaries will be SDE 2/3/4 or whatever.
Re: Amazon expected to announce NYC and Northern Virginia as new headquarters
#217Earlier quoted context omitted.
An hour is too much. Ain't nobody got time for one hour commuting each way.
I agree. An hour is considered a slightly above average commute in the Bay Area. However in NYC its considered way above average. When I was interviewing there, I was low key shocked that the interviewers considered 30 minutes to be a 'long' commute. Thats when I knew I was in the right place. Density + transit is the way to go.
Hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people commute more than an hour into Manhattan every day.
Just about everyone taking the LIRR or Metro North is commuting at least an hour and if they say they aren't, they're kidding themselves.
Re: Amazon expected to announce NYC and Northern Virginia as new headquarters
#218Did the world’s smartest company really need 13 months, and applications from 238 cities, to reach the striking conclusion that it should invest in New York and D.C.? The former is America’s heart of capital, and the latter is America’s literal capital, where Jeff Bezos, chief executive of Amazon, already owns a house and a newspaper. https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2018/11/amazons-hq...
Because that made them receive offers and tax cuts from city governments.
None of them they took advantage of. To what end?
Re: Amazon expected to announce NYC and Northern Virginia as new headquarters
#219Earlier quoted context omitted.
An SDE 2 isn't really a senior software engineer role, that would be SDE3, where many of which make closer to 300k.
I'm not an expert on Amazon, but I do have friends working there, so I asked them. They told me it's very rare for a new hire to come in as SDE3. Even a very experienced senior engineer is unlikely to get an offer above SDE2 level. SDE3 is thus not just a senior engineer, but one who has been with Amazon for several years. Per our discussion, that means very few of the new office employees are going to be above SDE2…
Close to 300k would be a person receiving an offer as an SDE 3, where with time spent at the company that amount is higher. It might have been different in my experience, but plenty of new people come in as SDE 3's should they have the relevant experience. The difference in compensation between amazon and fb/google/netflix is minimal except for at the very junior levels.
Re: Amazon expected to announce NYC and Northern Virginia as new headquarters
#220Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm not an expert on Amazon, but I do have friends working there, so I asked them. They told me it's very rare for a new hire to come in as SDE3. Even a very experienced senior engineer is unlikely to get an offer above SDE2 level. SDE3 is thus not just a senior engineer, but one who has been with Amazon for several years. Per our discussion, that means very few of the new office employees are going to be above SDE2…
Close to 300k would be a person receiving an offer as an SDE 3, where with time spent at the company that amount is higher. It might have been different in my experience, but plenty of new people come in as SDE 3's should they have the relevant experience. The difference in compensation between amazon and fb/google/netflix is minimal except for at the very junior levels.
All I can say is: it doesn't match the accounts I am hearing from friends.
For example, a couple of my friends interviewed with Amazon fairly recently, for senior engineering positions. In every case when the same person received an offer from Amazon + another FAANG - the other FAANG offer was substantially higher.
In one case I know the exact numbers, and the other FAANG offer was 50% (!) higher.
> The difference in compensation between amazon and fb/google/netflix is minimal except for at the very junior levels.
This not only contradicts what I know from friends, it also makes little sense. Hiring top talent straight out of college is a huge priority for companies like Amazon, which is trying to build a strong talent base. Underpaying at the entry level means they'll lose all the best candidates.
Only paying competitively at more senior levels means they're counting on these people to suddenly relocate to Seattle after 5-6+ years at another FAANG, which would never happen. Especially as Amazon doesn't pay particularly well at the senior level too.
You want to tell me an L4-5 from Google will move to Seattle to work as an SDE3 for "almost $300k"? I.E. take a 50% paycut to work for a company with worse reputation in an area that has far fewer tech jobs than the Bay? Mid career?
Please.
It's pretty well known that if you get an offer from Amazon and also from Facebook or Google, you will accept Facebook or Google. This is true for all levels, and the numbers you are quoting only confirm this preference.
My impression is that Amazon has been having trouble competing for top talent, and is working to improve its propositions, with this big new office in NYC being part of the pitch. They do have ways to go before they can actually compete with the better FAANGs out there, to the point when people will routinely choose them over Facebook or Google or Apple.