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Apple has removed us from the App Store

blog.rescuetime.com

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Re: Apple has removed us from the App Store

#91

Post by saagarjha »

cromwellian wrote: post #79
ancorevard wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not an abuse of power. This is looking out for their users' privacy. I would have thought most people at this time would know that Apple does not take lightly a situation where an app is sending lots of privacy related user behavior to some kind of server somewhere. At a minimum, store this analytics on the phone only. But then again, you may use APIs for reasons other than their intended purpose.

Shouldn't I have the choice? If you paid $1000 for a phone, and were using and enjoying this app, and suddenly, it can no longer be updated, because Apple says they want to 'protect' me, why can't I be given the control to decide whether or not I want this protection? After all, there are permissions dialogs. If an app needs location data, and asks me for it, why can't I decide to grant permission of the app to use i…

> Can't we protect users AND allow them to make informed decisions?

Unfortunately, the answer to this question currently seems to be “no”. I have not found a system that both allows people to have “choice” and also prevents the average user from messing up their device.

Re: Apple has removed us from the App Store

#92

Post by saagarjha »

dwaite wrote: post #76
lostmsu wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did not they explicitly tell what's it for? The title also claims other time-tracking apps were removed, so was is the reason? UPD. I see the title was edited, and they have retracted the others apps claim now. The first question still stands though.

Apple's ToS goes beyond asking the user for consent for a privacy or power-impacting feature; the review process is meant to also verify that the access is for an appropriate reason. This similar to how they ban apps that do cryptocurrency mining in the background. With the exception of a few specific Apple apps (Mail is actually the only one I know of now, and I believe it is more that the Mail app is a renderer of…

> With the exception of a few specific Apple apps (Mail is actually the only one I know of now, and I believe it is more that the Mail app is a renderer of the system mail process) and apps which use particular API (such as VOIP and navigation-related location), you cannot have your app run persistently in the background to preserve power and resources.

Apple has dozens of daemons that run continuously that handle everything from push notifications to fetching calendars to performing backups.

Re: Apple has removed us from the App Store

#93

Post by syshum »

Heliosmaster wrote: post #89
syshum wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>>If one kid in the kindergarten cannot handle the responsibility, unfortunately all of the little kids have to suffer from it. So you are claiming that most Apple users have the same mental capacity and personal responsibility of a Kindergarten age child?

Not the users, but the developers. They are the one which were unable to be responsible about permissions.

If a app seeks permissions to things you do not want it to have you then have the option to not install it. I do this all the time with many apps.

It is up to the USER not apple to choose what software to install and run on their computing devices.

Protecting people from themselves is what parents do, so clearly you look to Apple to be some kind of Parent protecting you from being unable to read the permission screen and think "do I want this app to have these permissions"

I would not have a huge issue with this if apple has methods to side load, or use 3rd party app stores in addition to the "offical" one, but if you are going to prevent anyway for a person to install apps outside of the official store then you better be pretty open about the apps you take.

Apples assault on personal freedom and choice is my biggest problem from their App store policies to their war on repair. Apple believes it should have full authority over the devices they sell, if they want that they should RENT them not sell them for $1,000

Re: Apple has removed us from the App Store

#94

Post by saagarjha »

jasonlotito wrote: post #14
gagege wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it should be legal for the owner of a store to decide not to sell a product, whatever the reason.

As Apple's customer, I don't see the "store" as so much a store as the way for me to install and update applications. After all, it shouldn't be legal for the owner of a store to break into my house and either take stuff or leave trash I don't want (something Apple is perfectly willing to do). Apple has chosen to position itself as the only way to install apps, which I feel is generally fine, but as Apple's customer,…

> it shouldn't be legal for the owner of a store to break into my house and either take stuff or leave trash I don't want (something Apple is perfectly willing to do).

Apple does not remove apps from your device, it stops you from downloading them. So this is still like a store refusing to sell something rather than a storeowner coming to your house and taking things.

Re: Apple has removed us from the App Store

#96

Post by Improvotter »

syshum wrote: post #93
Heliosmaster wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not the users, but the developers. They are the one which were unable to be responsible about permissions.

If a app seeks permissions to things you do not want it to have you then have the option to not install it. I do this all the time with many apps. It is up to the USER not apple to choose what software to install and run on their computing devices. Protecting people from themselves is what parents do, so clearly you look to Apple to be some kind of Parent protecting you from being unable to read the permission screen…

You're entitled to your opinion, and I am to mine. But I don't want something tracking me in the background. If that is your business model, then you should've thought of a different one. I don't care whether you think that Apple is a protective parent or not, one protective parent please!

Re: Apple has removed us from the App Store

#97

Post by ThomPete »

Improvotter wrote: post #86
syshum wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once Again, Apple telling users how they are allowed to use the devices they supposedly bought not rented from apple...

I'm glad the restriction is put in place. There were too many apps abusing constant location tracking. If one kid in the kindergarten cannot handle the responsibility, unfortunately all of the little kids have to suffer from it. Same goes with GDPR and net neutrality, regardless whether it's the government or a trillion dollar company.

Reading your comment on would think there are no alternatives, but that wouldd be wrong. In the case of location the app could simply be asking you if you would allow location tracking, with regards to GDRP there is absolutely nothing that indicate putting bureaucracy on the companies is a better way than simply having rules that can be fought in court with regards to the use of data. You argue as if there arent alternatives, but there are. You line of reasoning would ban everything because of what a minority do.

Re: Apple has removed us from the App Store

#98

Post by ThomPete »

Improvotter wrote: post #96
syshum wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a app seeks permissions to things you do not want it to have you then have the option to not install it. I do this all the time with many apps. It is up to the USER not apple to choose what software to install and run on their computing devices. Protecting people from themselves is what parents do, so clearly you look to Apple to be some kind of Parent protecting you from being unable to read the permission screen…

You're entitled to your opinion, and I am to mine. But I don't want something tracking me in the background. If that is your business model, then you should've thought of a different one. I don't care whether you think that Apple is a protective parent or not, one protective parent please!

No no no, you go further here, you claim that people shouldnt even be able to get the service even if they wanted to, in other words you are not even recognizing the parents right to his opinion you also want to have a say in whether HE should be able to get it.

Re: Apple has removed us from the App Store

#99

Post by jen20 »

laohu wrote: post #39

It is of note in this case that "misuse" is perfectly arbitrary. The RescueTime app did use location, only locally on the device, to enrich the information provided to users. It also happened to capture screen time, obviously important to the app. Be clear here: Apple has not said this aspect is misuse . Screen time recording is blessed by Apple. There are at least three other apps active in the app store that do the…

Your “disclaimer” note would be _much_ better positioned at the top of your post rather than the bottom...

Re: Apple has removed us from the App Store

#100

Post by mcfedr »

CharlesW wrote: post #6

> Critically, using the persistent location API also allows us to use an acknowledged acceptable way to capture when our users have active screen time. They're admitting to using background location to infer screen time, which is clearly "misuse" according to section 2.5.4. Whether the decision is right or wrong, I find it hard to believe that the developer is actually confused by this.

Right or wrong - it's one of the only was to implement this at the moment and apple are trying to kill the competition.

I develop an app that does similar features, we are currently still in the store but apple won't let us release any updates for 3-4 months now. They keep saying rubbish like this but at the end of the day they don't want competition for this own apps.

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