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“A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

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Re: “A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

#221

Post by meko »

CWuestefeld wrote: post #3

If we think that not enough people are voting, the way to solve this is NOT through get-out-the-vote efforts, voter registration drives, and tools like this to make it easier to cast a vote. These are not the bottleneck. Voting may be a duty, but it's one that carries a lot of responsibility. Getting ignorant people to cast poorly-informed votes does not help our society. And I think that people realize this. So when…

But those things impair business' short term profitability so they won't happen.

Re: “A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

#222

Post by octorian »

wasdfff wrote: post #214
jkaljundi wrote: post #128

As an Estonian who has voted online and via mobile ID for years, couldn't imagine going to vote in a physical location, using pen and paper.

Pen and paper is hardly done in the US except provisionally. All my votes were cast on a touchscreen with a printed paper recipes that I could look at and confirm of my choice. The paper ballot is kept by the board of elections. Whose to stop bad actors from manipulating electronic votes? Whose to say your vote was even tallied? It is far easier to manipulate elections electronically. If Russian operatives are able t…

> Pen and paper is hardly done in the US except provisionally.

Every state in the US can have a different system in place for the actual voting process. These systems also change over time. Pen and paper is used in plenty of the US, just not necessarily in your district.

Of course the pen-and-paper system is designed to be electronically scanned, at least.

Re: “A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

#223

Post by tomjen3 »

camgunz wrote: post #169

VBM and compulsory voting is basically the only way to get turnout > 90%. You can try to get people fired up about elections, but we're well past diminishing returns on that front. You can try to lower barriers to voting, but even in states like Oregon with auto-registration and VBM it's still lower than 70%. If you look at any place with > 90% turnout, they have compulsory voting. And once you have that you have a s…

Denmark has 85+ without compulsery voting, because we have more than one party.

The US only issue is that you have fpp. Solving that will solve the rest, compulsery voting will just hide it and make sure it is never sold.

Re: “A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

#224

Post by rootusrootus »

downandout wrote: post #78
mdorazio wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, but it's important to note that many people don't vote in the US because they simply don't have the time to leave work/school and go to a polling place, or won't get paid for it if they do [1]. More mail-in ballots could potentially alleviate this, but a lot of people prefer to vote in person. Also due to our two-party system, gerrymandering, and the way congress works, many people don't vote because they fe…

many people don't vote because they feel it doesn't make a difference This is actually the case in many areas. For example, casting a vote for a Republican Presidential candidate in California is a pointless endeavor. This sentiment doesn’t arise from lack of voter education, but rather from voter education - people understand the political makeup of the areas in which they live, and in those that are overwhelmingly…

That's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Kinda like millenials complaining about boomers voting for things they don't like, while simultaneously not turning out to vote even though as a group they outnumber the boomers and could actually effect change if they bothered to show up.

Re: “A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

#225

Post by pbhjpbhj »

tmaly wrote: post #144
athenot wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving voting day from a Tuesday to a Sunday would also make a big difference. There are many people who have have informed opinions but can't afford to take off work (write-up for being late to work/take off early, lost income, transport issues). Also that would avoid removing a school day since most public schools are used for polling. Another option would be to switch to make mail-in ballots only.

a Saturday or Sunday would have a much higher turnout. However, you would still be excluding a large number of lower income service workers that work on the weekend.

Has it been tested, I'm not convinced.

One group effected negatively could be parents. They may find it more difficult to vote if their kids aren't in school. Particularly single parents. (I vote after the kids go to bed - but have taken a child to the polls a couple of times - but I have a partner to stay home and make that possible).

Re: “A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

#226

Post by gliptic »

simias wrote: post #101
tempay wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s why I believe early votes should be allowed to be overwritten by in-person votes. It's an interesting idea, though how would you maintain the secret ballot? If you ask them to make a "negative vote" they can suddenly vote three times without any chance of being caught.

You could keep the ballot sealed but tied to the voter's ID. Once the polling center closes for every mailed-in ballot they check if they have an in-person vote. If so, they discard it, otherwise they add it in the urn before it's opened for counting.

This is actually how it works in Sweden. They check the voter list whether the person already voted during the day and discards the mail-in if so.

Re: “A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

#227

Post by wasdfff »

AnthonyWnC wrote: post #217

It is hilarious and idiotic to see all these modern luddite think that somehow electronic X (in this case, voting) won't work or can't be secure. And yes, paper voting has to be the best solution ever. /s

Every piece of software can be exploited given enough effort and time. Things are only secure until they are broken. In the year of spectre and meltdown exploits, you balk at the idea that electronics are insecure?

Re: “A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

#228

Post by icebraining »

adrianN wrote: post #137
dforrestwilson wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do I even need to elect a Congressman/woman to make decisions for me? Just let me do it directly now that the technology is here. We should vote on issues in real time, or within a week or month-long window. It would incentivize people with time and interest to be more involved, and get rid of that pesky agency problem. At the very least we can marginalize the role of politicians and perhaps be less disappointed…

Jesus no. Even full time politicians don't have the time to read all the bills they vote on. You really don't want to reduce complex legislation to single sentence statements that casuals can vote on in between checking their Facebook feeds. See Brexit for an example how that would turn out.

See Brexit for an example how that would turn out.

And see the UK support for the Iraq War for an example of the reverse.

What's the death toll of Brexit?

Re: “A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

#229

Post by adrianN »

tomjen3 wrote: post #210
adrianN wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jesus no. Even full time politicians don't have the time to read all the bills they vote on. You really don't want to reduce complex legislation to single sentence statements that casuals can vote on in between checking their Facebook feeds. See Brexit for an example how that would turn out.

You don't need to read the bills, you just need somebody to check if there are any mines in them. You can find some who share your political views.

You could call those people your "representatives" and even defer your vote to them!

Re: “A Horrifically Bad Idea”: Smartphone Voting Is Coming

#230

Post by wasdfff »

tim333 wrote: post #151

It seems hard to vote electronically in a way that can't be hacked and is fully private but for those that are not too bothered by privacy it seems ok. I mean I voted Labour in the last thing and aren't bothered if someone finds out. You could still go do the paper ballot thing if worried.

The worry isn’t how you voted; in the US your party affiliation is already public. It’s ensuring the vote count is correct.
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