Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

bbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 127 posts

Re: Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

#31

Post by rbg246 »

hyperpallium wrote: post #25
pseudolus wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the significant differences is that in the 1980s when the issue of ozone depletion was being confronted, politics was not as polarized. One of the great successes of those arguing for action was recruiting Conservative British Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, a trained chemist, as an advocate https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/energy/2016/10/will-ma...

Dr. Margaret Thatcher EDIT I must apologise to my parent, and to HN in general. Her thesis was undergraduate: > ... four-year Chemistry Bachelor of Science degree, specialising in X-ray crystallography under the supervision of Dorothy Hodgkin. Her dissertation was on the structure of the antibiotic gramicidin. https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Thatcher

Couldn't see from her wikipedia page where she gained her doctorate?

Re: Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

#32

Post by kazinator »

A2017U1 wrote: post #15

If only we could get such swift global action on greenhouse emissions. Both problems are essentially the same yet the difference in action couldn't be wider.

They are not really the same: eliminate the accidental release of niche refrigerant substances for which substitutes are available, versus the mass spewage of CO2 and hydrocarbons.

Note that refrigerants can be substituted without changing the refrigeration hardware at all. No infrastructure changes are required. There is no "tech stack disruption" at all.

Re: Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

#33

Post by bencollier49 »

hyperpallium wrote: post #25
pseudolus wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the significant differences is that in the 1980s when the issue of ozone depletion was being confronted, politics was not as polarized. One of the great successes of those arguing for action was recruiting Conservative British Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, a trained chemist, as an advocate https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/energy/2016/10/will-ma...

Dr. Margaret Thatcher EDIT I must apologise to my parent, and to HN in general. Her thesis was undergraduate: > ... four-year Chemistry Bachelor of Science degree, specialising in X-ray crystallography under the supervision of Dorothy Hodgkin. Her dissertation was on the structure of the antibiotic gramicidin. https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Thatcher

She may have received honorary doctorates and she was a research chemist, but not a PhD.

Re: Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

#34

Post by crispinb »

dqpb wrote: post #4

I'm not an expert, but repairing/healing seems like a misleading analogy for what's happening

No expert either, but it seems fairly apposite. The atmosphere is continuously generated by a vast complex system. This incorporates many homeostatic mechanisms tending to push the system back to its dynamically stable state. As long as we don't push the system too far, removing recent perturbations will result in auto-repair.

This is one of the few sources of hope that we can step back from the ecological-collapse abyss. In many cases we just have to get out of the way. Unfortunately, we probably won't. Replacing complex evolved enduring systems with primitive technological short-lived ones makes heaps of cash.

Re: Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

#35

Post by decebalus1 »

xavierstein wrote: post #24

My father-in-law firmly believes that the hole in the ozone was caused by space shuttle reentry, and that's why it's patching now, and also that CFCs couldn't possibly make the hole because they are heavier than air. Does anyone have the data to refute these claims?

Ideally the person who claims something needs to provide the data to back it up.

My father-in-law doesn't believe that the moon landings took place. All the data in the world cannot convince him otherwise. The only good strategy in the face of these types of claims is to go up the crazy scale. For example when he tells me that the moon landings didn't happen, I tell him he's naive it he thinks the moon exists. The moon was blown up in the 50's due to a nuclear test gone wrong and what we're seeing now is an artificial projection.

Re: Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

#36

Post by ryanwaggoner »

hyperpallium wrote: post #25
pseudolus wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the significant differences is that in the 1980s when the issue of ozone depletion was being confronted, politics was not as polarized. One of the great successes of those arguing for action was recruiting Conservative British Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher, a trained chemist, as an advocate https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/energy/2016/10/will-ma...

Dr. Margaret Thatcher EDIT I must apologise to my parent, and to HN in general. Her thesis was undergraduate: > ... four-year Chemistry Bachelor of Science degree, specialising in X-ray crystallography under the supervision of Dorothy Hodgkin. Her dissertation was on the structure of the antibiotic gramicidin. https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Thatcher

Surely the Prime Minister title wins out?

Actually, that’s an interesting question: since “Dr” usually replaces “Mr” for a man, would a male president with a doctorate be “Dr President”?

Re: Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

#37

Post by takeda »

seiferteric wrote: post #28
xavierstein wrote: post #24

My father-in-law firmly believes that the hole in the ozone was caused by space shuttle reentry, and that's why it's patching now, and also that CFCs couldn't possibly make the hole because they are heavier than air. Does anyone have the data to refute these claims?

Does he think the space shuttle was/is the only craft reentering the atmosphere?

What if the space shuttle is powered by CFC? /s

Re: Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

#38

Post by jedberg »

ryanwaggoner wrote: post #36
hyperpallium wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dr. Margaret Thatcher EDIT I must apologise to my parent, and to HN in general. Her thesis was undergraduate: > ... four-year Chemistry Bachelor of Science degree, specialising in X-ray crystallography under the supervision of Dorothy Hodgkin. Her dissertation was on the structure of the antibiotic gramicidin. https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Thatcher

Surely the Prime Minister title wins out? Actually, that’s an interesting question: since “Dr” usually replaces “Mr” for a man, would a male president with a doctorate be “Dr President”?

Probably not. President would take precedent. See Chancellor Merkel for a good example (she has a PhD).

Re: Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

#39

Post by rixrax »

xavierstein wrote: post #24

My father-in-law firmly believes that the hole in the ozone was caused by space shuttle reentry, and that's why it's patching now, and also that CFCs couldn't possibly make the hole because they are heavier than air. Does anyone have the data to refute these claims?

This is kind of funny. Until you realize that some people actually believe this stuff. Either way, burden of proof should always work the other way around. Other than strong believe, did this father-in-law actually offer some scientific evidence/proof to support his theory?

This is not to say that established theories would always hold scrutiny. Thinking of e.g. what we thought about tectonic plate movements/continental drift only ~100 years a go.

Re: Ozone: The Earth's protective shield is repairing

#40

Post by ThomPete »

A2017U1 wrote: post #15

If only we could get such swift global action on greenhouse emissions. Both problems are essentially the same yet the difference in action couldn't be wider.

One big difference is that you could prove the ozone layers thining and so it was easy to get political backup, plus the solution was fairly simple. The climate debate is mostly political and there is no way to prove the effects only speculate. If just people would let scientists do science and not mix in political agendas we would have been much better of and money could have been spent for things we can actually do rather than being wasted on lofty political projects.
Post reply on HN