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Oceans 'soaking up more heat than estimated'

bbc.co.uk

81–90 of 225 posts

Re: Oceans 'soaking up more heat than estimated'

#81
post #10

Nuclear war can reverse global warming [1]. Some argue that since nuclear weapons exist, they will likely be used sooner or later. 1. https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2011/02/110223-nucl...

Every problem has a solution that's simple, elegant, and wrong.

Re: Oceans 'soaking up more heat than estimated'

#82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's not capitalism because authoritarian states aren't cutting emissions either. Are they capitalistic or economies though? Right wing systems that value privitization? Countries that are cutting emissions in extremely significant manners (relative to their countries, they can't control the world), and putting out well reachable net-zero emissions goals, are the furthest left wing countries in the world at the mome…

You could have a right-wing communist state, just imagine what would happen if you made a commune out of poor US rural republicans. The "left-wing" countries aren't cutting emissions due to their system of government, they are cutting emissions because of the attitude of their people.

The government they have is a direct representation of the people, who collectively have put checks on capitalism to be able to favor their own lives and the lives of their fellow citizens over capital.

Re: Oceans 'soaking up more heat than estimated'

#83
post #77
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if you don't want to go vegan, it's easy to eat less meat (and probably good for your health if you have a Western diet). My partner is vegetarian, I eat meat occasionally (and when I do I eat good meat, ethically and sustainably farmed). Reducing meat consumption is by far the easiest way to reduce your carbon footprint.

>ethically and sustainably farmed There is no such meat in the beef or chicken industry. There are sustainable methods to raise and provide enough meat for the demand and there are ethical methods (e.g. cage free, free range) that are absolutely not sustainable given the demand for meat. There is no overlap.

> "...for the demand"

If demand is lowered by the population at large consuming a lot less meat, then it's perfectly reasonable to produce meat ethically and sustainably.

Chickens/eggs, etc.

Re: Oceans 'soaking up more heat than estimated'

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nonsense. Grazing animals are part of the natural cycle that has produced grasses, the topsoil, and nutrients that tie them together. Vegetarianism breaks that cycle and leads to use of chemicals for growing edible plants.

> Vegetarianism breaks that cycle and leads to use of chemicals for growing edible plants. What? It is pretty clear cut that humans eating plants directly requires growing a lot less plants than humans eating meat, which ate those plants. Animals don't grow on sunlight, so they are basically a reactor for turning plants from one type of food into another. And the laws of thermodynamics tell us they aren't 100% effici…

What the commenter probably refers to is the fact that grazing animals eat plants which humans can not eat while vegetarians eat those which are suitable for human consumption. The grass eaten by herbivores 'just grows' while the cabbages, lettuces, beans and sprouts (et al) eaten by vegetarians (et al) don't "just grow", they need to be grown purposefully on soil which has been fertilised, they need to be protected from insects and vermin, etcetera.

Had the herbivores been harvested from the wild this would all be true. In practice the herbivores are fed not just grass but beans, grains and other produce. Which has to be grown just like the vegetables eaten by vegetarians. Since the 'conversion factor' - the efficiency by which an animal transforms 1 kg of fodder into 1 kg of edible animal - varies from about 2 (insects) via 5-7 (chicken) via 9-11 (pig) to 14-18 (cow) it becomes clear that it takes a lot more grains, beans and such to feed a carnivore than it takes to feed a vegetarian.

Re: Oceans 'soaking up more heat than estimated'

#85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why govt's aren't tasking their militaries with using their considerable resources to find solutions to climate change - they have, at minimun the following skills: science, tech, manpower, organisational ability.

Because there's no political will and nobody cares. https://www.vox.com/2016/10/4/13118594/2-degrees-no-more-fos... Honestly, we're just going to keep sleepwalking into catastrophe.

What makes you think that the powers that be are sleepwalking? They know it's coming and they want to be out on top when it does.

Hence the anti-refugee, anti-immigrant talk -- might as well start early and get people in the mindset to deal harshly with mass migration caused by climate change.

Hence the continued military build-up and the consolidation of armed forces in hot-zones (multiple meanings to 'hot')

Hence the rise of protectionism (free trade won't mean much in a climate crisis world anyways)

Hence the rise of nationalism (what's "mine" is mine)

There are too many advantages to being the last to do anything, and it's too late to do anything without a major revolution or civil war. The whole world economy goes into a tailspin over a relatively minor increase in the barrel price of oil -- imagine what it will do if oil goes up by 1000%, which is what it would need to do to stop its rampant consumption...

I love my kids, but sometimes wish I hadn't had any.

Re: Oceans 'soaking up more heat than estimated'

#86
post #56

1) Go watch the movie cowspiracy on netflix. Go vegan. 2) Get an energy audit and see if your home needs more insulation. If a solar panel installation will pay for itself in a reasonable time where you live (rebates - SRECs - etc) consider getting one. 3) If you live in a warmer climate with safe biking paths - get an electric bike to go to work. 4) The next car you get should be electric or plugin hybrid. Even if i…

What I am finding in my road to eating less meat is that vegetarian food seems to take a lot longer to prepare. I can knock up a steak with mushrooms and brocolli in about 10 minutes. I am finding to create something just as satisfying that's vegetarian is some form of pie or lasagne that is delicious but takes an entire evening to cook. What would the vegetarian equivalent to a quick steak be?

A salad with some pan-fried halloumi cheese and pine nuts is quick and satisfying, though probably too salty to eat every day. Halloumi works as a meat substitute in a lot of recipes.

Lentils and onions over rice will fill you up, but it's certainly less fun than a steak.

Stir fries are quick, fun to cook and satisfying. Slice a couple of hard-boiled eggs, add soy sauce and sesame seeds, and serve over the stir-fried veg.

Re: Oceans 'soaking up more heat than estimated'

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The endless growth of runaway Capitalism with no plans to put a halt to is potentially our great filter. We'll need to send another Sagan vinyl up to warn about the dangers of Capitalism among societies. IPCC claims we need to expand beyond capitalism to solve this [1]. [1] https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/10/18/the-hope-at-the-heart-o...

It's not capitalism because authoritarian states aren't cutting emissions either. Capitalism gives the people with money what they want, autocracies give the people with power what they want, and so on, and not one single distribution of getting-what-they-want is going vegan and cutting emissions to zero. The only remaining conclusion is that nobody wants to go vegan and stop emissions. If you want a government that…

Capitalism is fully compatible with authoritarianism and often even welcomes it. Authoritarian states are more willing to help reduce costs incurred by things like human rights and labor laws.

Re: Oceans 'soaking up more heat than estimated'

#89
post #76
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China is a communist state. China is, actually, the living proof capitalism works a lot better without a democracy holding it back.

For the majority, perhaps. Try telling that to the Uighurs of Xinjiang.

There is nothing in a democracy either that prevents minorities from being oppressed. Examples of democratic countries with oppressed minorities are plenty.

Re: Oceans 'soaking up more heat than estimated'

#90
post #73
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think all of these things are set in motion by people making efforts like going vegetarian.

No, people making personal efforts like that has the opposite effect. It makes them think they are doing something that matters so they don't put any effort into pushing for the drastic changes required to fix the problem. People making individual efforts like that is about as useful as praying when it comes to preventing tragedy of the commons scenarios.

You could say that the effort is vain, but saying that it "has the opposite effect" is quite a strong statement. I am interested to hear how individual efforts of going vegetarian/vegan are contributing to global warming. And could you expand on "putting effort into pushing for the drastic changes"?
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