Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Feds: Chinese spies orchestrated hack that stole aviation secrets

arstechnica.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 95 posts

Re: Feds: Chinese spies orchestrated hack that stole aviation secrets

#41

Post by thereare5lights »

jorblumesea wrote: post #11

As much as I think the tariffs are not the right solution, something needs to be done to punish Chinese aggression towards the West. They've been playing very dirty without any real consequences. Trade should not be conducted through industrial espionage or intelligence agencies as a standard approach. The blurred line between Chinese intelligence and Chinese businesses is a dangerous one as it can turn IP theft into…

> Trade should not be conducted through industrial espionage or intelligence agencies as a standard approach.

That's literally how it's worked throughout history. Europeans did it. Americans did it. Now the Chinese are doing it.

Should and how the world actually works are two different things that do not always align.

Re: Feds: Chinese spies orchestrated hack that stole aviation secrets

#42

Post by nraynaud »

JPKab wrote: post #32
nraynaud wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember that the CIA did worse (like droning children in Yemen), be careful what you wish for.

Yes, and the American people are allowed to talk about that, protest it and discuss it without being imprisoned. The knee-jerk "whataboutism" in discussions like these does nothing to help. While I understand the desire by many to hold the US more accountable, combined with the instinctive "love the underdog, hate the champ" philosophy that shapes the narrative of the global left wing, keep in mind that China's curre…

1) the whole point would be to prosecute it, not "discuss it". It's allowed to be discussed to the extent that nothing comes out of it, hence the classification of the details.

2) Remember that the narrative of the current US president is that the US is the underdog attacked from everywhere, and so some categories of enemies should be designated and dealt with at large scale and brutally, some of those ennemies will be internal sub-categories of people, and that the economy of war should be reinforced.

I am not really defending China (just a bit, because I feel the racist undertone on those attacks), but I think having the last super-power behave like a good neighbor and a role model would have a more positive impact on the world than designating a few ennemies, waging war, destroying internal democracy to concentrate the power, and acting generally like a bully.

Re: Feds: Chinese spies orchestrated hack that stole aviation secrets

#43

Post by nraynaud »

TheRealWatson wrote: post #24
nraynaud wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember that the CIA did worse (like droning children in Yemen), be careful what you wish for.

I thought the topic was world trade.

The topic is exposing spying operations in a bigger narrative of victimhood.

Re: Feds: Chinese spies orchestrated hack that stole aviation secrets

#44

Post by paulie_a »

thereare5lights wrote: post #37
mulmen wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what your point is in your last two sentences. Should the US not defend its interests against foreign powers?

OP is saying that the US doesn't have the moral high ground and anyone spouting off about how badly China is acting is just being asinine since we do the exact same thing to everyone (and if we weren't then our intelligence agencies need to get off their asses and do it).

There is a fine line in spycraft. Stealing secrets from companies for commercial gain is just pathetic. Can't innovate, just hack it and steal it.

Re: Feds: Chinese spies orchestrated hack that stole aviation secrets

#45

Post by thereare5lights »

paulie_a wrote: post #44
thereare5lights wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP is saying that the US doesn't have the moral high ground and anyone spouting off about how badly China is acting is just being asinine since we do the exact same thing to everyone (and if we weren't then our intelligence agencies need to get off their asses and do it).

There is a fine line in spycraft. Stealing secrets from companies for commercial gain is just pathetic. Can't innovate, just hack it and steal it.

> Stealing secrets from companies for commercial gain is just pathetic. Can't innovate, just hack it and steal it.

Learn your history. Everyone does it. Europeans and Americans did it. Now the Chinese are doing. The only reason we're bitching is because now we're the targets instead of the thieves.

Re: Feds: Chinese spies orchestrated hack that stole aviation secrets

#46

Post by vkou »

justicezyx wrote: post #18

As an ethical Chinese myself, I'd like to reiterate that this type event is government-backed. And I am confident that HNers respect the boundary between Chinese people and the government. I do want to point out that general Chinese people in mainland China view these type of activities negatively as well. It should not be thought as the general people endorse such activities, they were mostly made unaware of these,…

> As an ethical Chinese myself

What is unethical about nation states spying on other nation states' militaries? The aerospace industry - of every country - is intimately entangled with their defense departments.

Re: Feds: Chinese spies orchestrated hack that stole aviation secrets

#47

Post by eternalban »

api_or_ipa wrote: post #40

I love reading about the Chinese efforts in developing a modern turbofan engine. For whatever reason, they just can't build a good medium- or high- bypass turbofan in-house. They're latest WS-20 is basically a clone of the CFM-56 and previously they spent decades developing the WS-6 and WS-10 that never met expectations. This is a big deal because the Comac 919 is ready to go but without a powerplant, they're having…

The Soviets also couldn't crack the jet engine but the English helpfully provided a Rolls-Royce engine for the Mig-15 just in time for the Korean War.

"What fool will sell us his secrets?", asked Uncle Joe Stalin. "I will", said Sir Richard Stafford Cripps, CH, FRS.

Re: Feds: Chinese spies orchestrated hack that stole aviation secrets

#48

Post by paulie_a »

thereare5lights wrote: post #45
paulie_a wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a fine line in spycraft. Stealing secrets from companies for commercial gain is just pathetic. Can't innovate, just hack it and steal it.

> Stealing secrets from companies for commercial gain is just pathetic. Can't innovate, just hack it and steal it. Learn your history. Everyone does it. Europeans and Americans did it. Now the Chinese are doing. The only reason we're bitching is because now we're the targets instead of the thieves.

Do you have any links about about industrial scale hacking for commercial profit by those regions?

Re: Feds: Chinese spies orchestrated hack that stole aviation secrets

#50

Post by hopefulengineer »

nraynaud wrote: post #42
JPKab wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, and the American people are allowed to talk about that, protest it and discuss it without being imprisoned. The knee-jerk "whataboutism" in discussions like these does nothing to help. While I understand the desire by many to hold the US more accountable, combined with the instinctive "love the underdog, hate the champ" philosophy that shapes the narrative of the global left wing, keep in mind that China's curre…

1) the whole point would be to prosecute it, not "discuss it". It's allowed to be discussed to the extent that nothing comes out of it, hence the classification of the details. 2) Remember that the narrative of the current US president is that the US is the underdog attacked from everywhere, and so some categories of enemies should be designated and dealt with at large scale and brutally, some of those ennemies will…

>I think having the last super-power behave like a good neighbor and a role model would have a more positive impact on the world

the US was the only country on earth that had nukes for 5 years and was unscathed from WWII. We could have enslaved the entire planet under threat of nuclear fire, but instead we gave away billions to help Japan and Europe rebuild. There's never been a more selfless act in human history as far as a country not seizing an opportunity to gain power is concerned. There's probably never been a larger power disparity between a single country and the rest of the world than post WWII USA, and they did exactly nothing to take advantage of that disparity.

Not to say US is innocent in recent years, but it's still minor considering there's nothing stopping us from plundering the world other than our own morals

>I am not really defending China (just a bit, because I feel the racist undertone on those attacks)

Russia gets slammed just as hard on all fronts and nobody cares to defend them, China can take a little abuse.

Post reply on HN