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In Amazon Go, no one thinks I'm stealing

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Re: In Amazon Go, no one thinks I'm stealing

#31

Post by cbg0 »

pentae wrote: post #25
andrew_ wrote: post #22

Tossing in my own anecdotal experience: I worked in Loss Prevention (plain clothes security) for a major midwest retail chain, within 10 miles of a major metropolitan city for several years. We absolutely profiled customers. The catch is that we profiled teenagers of the Caucasian persuasion. Why? Because they were the folks most likely to try and lift goods. Folks wearing unnecessarily baggy clothing (think more tha…

Of course, if you'd swapped out the word "Caucasian" for "African American" your post would be downvoted and you'd be called a racist. But because we're DEFINITELY not racist mentioning you targeted white people is totally fine in 2018.

As long as this is andrew_'s personal experience, I don't see why I'd call him a racist regardless of the race he profiled the most. He even goes on to explain that there's a good reason for targeting white teenagers: they were the most likely to steal something, so they weren't targeted because they're white, they were targeted because they proved to be the highest risk.

Now if andrew_ had started generalizing, like you are doing, then I could see him getting called a racist and getting downvoted.

Re: In Amazon Go, no one thinks I'm stealing

#32

Post by Scoundreller »

repsilat wrote: post #26
askmike wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wonder if it might be worth volunteering that information without any convenience/price reward if it means the shop might somehow act to serve me better as a customer. If they'd serve you better that automatically means they'd serve everyone else worse who didn't want to give up that information. You'll love the Social Credit System in China: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Credit_System This is not a world…

> they'd serve everyone else worse That doesn't follow. It could be positive-sum. Just from the checkout (without customer identifiers) they can find correlations. "People who buy salsa tend to buy corn chips. Let's put them near each other in the store." With identifiers they might be able to do more things of that sort. "A few customers shop in two different locations -- over here for fresh produce, but over there…

I want to know what the bibles get stocked next to...

Re: In Amazon Go, no one thinks I'm stealing

#34

Post by retsibsi »

pentae wrote: post #25
andrew_ wrote: post #22

Tossing in my own anecdotal experience: I worked in Loss Prevention (plain clothes security) for a major midwest retail chain, within 10 miles of a major metropolitan city for several years. We absolutely profiled customers. The catch is that we profiled teenagers of the Caucasian persuasion. Why? Because they were the folks most likely to try and lift goods. Folks wearing unnecessarily baggy clothing (think more tha…

Of course, if you'd swapped out the word "Caucasian" for "African American" your post would be downvoted and you'd be called a racist. But because we're DEFINITELY not racist mentioning you targeted white people is totally fine in 2018.

I'm annoyed by some of the same things as you, but you shouldn't pretend there's not an important difference here. Racially profiling against a disadvantaged minority group with a history of appalling treatment at the hands of the majority is one thing; doing the same to members of a group with none of those characteristics is another. It's pretty obvious why one might be significantly more hurtful, offensive, controversial, etc. than the other -- and it has little to do with the (dumb, offensive) 'fuck white men' stuff you seem to be reacting to.

Re: In Amazon Go, no one thinks I'm stealing

#36

Post by salvar »

andrew_ wrote: post #22

Tossing in my own anecdotal experience: I worked in Loss Prevention (plain clothes security) for a major midwest retail chain, within 10 miles of a major metropolitan city for several years. We absolutely profiled customers. The catch is that we profiled teenagers of the Caucasian persuasion. Why? Because they were the folks most likely to try and lift goods. Folks wearing unnecessarily baggy clothing (think more tha…

Maybe not the specific narrative of the article, but surely whatever the profiling looks like the narrative of "In Amazon Go, you're not profiled based on your looks" fits.

Re: In Amazon Go, no one thinks I'm stealing

#37

Post by mattigames »

retsibsi wrote: post #34
pentae wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, if you'd swapped out the word "Caucasian" for "African American" your post would be downvoted and you'd be called a racist. But because we're DEFINITELY not racist mentioning you targeted white people is totally fine in 2018.

I'm annoyed by some of the same things as you, but you shouldn't pretend there's not an important difference here. Racially profiling against a disadvantaged minority group with a history of appalling treatment at the hands of the majority is one thing; doing the same to members of a group with none of those characteristics is another. It's pretty obvious why one might be significantly more hurtful, offensive, contro…

So what you are saying is that profiling against a group with a history of appalling treatment at the hands of the majority is one thing, but doing the same with a different profiling is wrong, because clothing is clearly a choice but skin color is clearly not; despite being white boys raised among hundreds of people with the same clothing preference we should expect such young men to go against their surroundings and pick any other forms of clothing in order to be worthy of not being pre-judged right?

Re: In Amazon Go, no one thinks I'm stealing

#38

Post by salvar »

esotericn wrote: post #8

Profiling sucks. In this case though, I'd say you're simply trading one injustice for another. You go from the ephemeral experience of having a few underpaid lackeys mistrust you, to having an eternal database of everything you buy owned by a third party. Then again, it's getting pretty ridiculous everywhere. The local supermarkets around me - they've gradually stripped real checkout operators away and replaced them…

Why do you assume that the experience is ephemeral? It sounds like you're trying to downplay the experience of black people being profiled in stores.

I think that for people that have to deal with this kind of discrimination day in day out for most of their lives, regardless of how much you believe they're exaggerating, trading that for Amazon's database of their purchases is a sweet deal.

Re: In Amazon Go, no one thinks I'm stealing

#39

Post by Nasrudith »

InclinedPlane wrote: post #20
esotericn wrote: post #8

Profiling sucks. In this case though, I'd say you're simply trading one injustice for another. You go from the ephemeral experience of having a few underpaid lackeys mistrust you, to having an eternal database of everything you buy owned by a third party. Then again, it's getting pretty ridiculous everywhere. The local supermarkets around me - they've gradually stripped real checkout operators away and replaced them…

Not only that but you also raise the requirements for grocery / department store shopping. In principle all you need to shop at most stores is cash and being able to get to the physical location of the store. With Amazon Go you need a smartphone with a data plan, an amazon account, and a bank account. Even in America not everyone has all of those, or even any one of those. I personally spent a few years as an adult w…

While fiscal underserving remains a problem there are $20 burner phones which are smartphones. Gift cards and prepaids can be used as well by those without. An extra obstacle certainly but one that can be overcome surprisingly easily.

Re: In Amazon Go, no one thinks I'm stealing

#40

Post by nielsole »

cbg0 wrote: post #31
pentae wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, if you'd swapped out the word "Caucasian" for "African American" your post would be downvoted and you'd be called a racist. But because we're DEFINITELY not racist mentioning you targeted white people is totally fine in 2018.

As long as this is andrew_'s personal experience, I don't see why I'd call him a racist regardless of the race he profiled the most. He even goes on to explain that there's a good reason for targeting white teenagers: they were the most likely to steal something, so they weren't targeted because they're white, they were targeted because they proved to be the highest risk. Now if andrew_ had started generalizing, like…

Racial profiling is being criticized despite being effective.

There is an argument to be made that you shouldn't be treated differently based on the color of your skin. In fact it is e.g. in the German constitution.

http://m.spiegel.de/international/germany/racial-profiling-g...

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