America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away • Hacker News Board

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#121

Post by kd0amg » Wed, Oct 24, 2018, 5:49 PM UTC

EduardoBautista wrote: post #55

johnvanommen wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could index it with cost of living. So an H1B in a California company would expect to see a higher salary than one in Kansas.

That still doesn't consider pay differences between two completely different jobs.

Then it would be working as intended. Jobs where labor isn't so scarce as to push prevailing wages up really high don't need extra labor brought into the market.

The remaining concern is distorted markets like foreign language teachers (brought up elsewhere in the thread), where it may be politically infeasible to raise compensation to match the value workers create.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#122

Post by njarboe » Wed, Oct 24, 2018, 5:52 PM UTC

firedrakerage wrote: post #11

I do not typically post, but these suggestions seem like genuine improvements to the existing system: "Kerr suggests allocating H-1Bs not by lottery as they are now, but by salary — the more that a company is willing to pay for a foreign worker, the quicker they can get a visa." "A second change would be to allow H-1B workers to apply for permanent residency green cards on their own, without having to be sponsored by…

How about allocating some large number of 6 year work visas by a pure auction? The visa goes with the person, they can work anywhere, and after the visa is up can be a US citizen with minimal hassle. Employers could pay the fee for people to come and work for them, if they like, with a claw-back clause, if necessary. It would be interesting to see what the price would be for such a visa.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#123

Post by rhexs » Wed, Oct 24, 2018, 5:53 PM UTC

damnyou wrote: post #95

dudul wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, but that's not what the original message was pointing out. Comparing countries stealing other countries skilled workers and companies poaching employees is not a good idea IMO, that's all.

It's the same thing, it's just the barriers are different. Silicon Valley is successful partly because noncompetes don't get enforced in California. It makes things slightly worse in the short term for each company but better for both the individuals and the world overall. The US has been successful partly because it's attracted so many skilled immigrants. It makes things slightly worse for other countries in the sho…

Citation? Brain drain, so that Silicon Valley can produce various ride-sharing and world-changing pizza delivery apps, is better for the world?

I certainly think it's better for the rich as it drives the stock market up, but a blanket "better for the world overall" is certainly an interesting take.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#124

Post by akhilcacharya » Wed, Oct 24, 2018, 5:53 PM UTC

jki275 wrote: post #97

ojbyrne wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That page references John Boehner and Mitt Romney, who don’t have any influence in Republican policy anymore. The current administration has repeatedly demonstrated their antipathy to legal immigration.

Cite please. The current administration has never done anything to show antipathy to legal immigration, the first lady is a legal immigrant as are her parents.

She's a white legal immigrant.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#125

Post by angarg12 » Wed, Oct 24, 2018, 5:54 PM UTC

sbr464 wrote: post #21

A side benefit that I hadn’t really considered but seems obvious; By taking in skilled workers from other countries, it’s like poaching talent from another company. Then they aren’t contributing to or building companies in their former country. Not sure the scale you would need to make a dent, but is there a name for this?

Brain Drain is a real issue in some parts of the world.

I grew up in Spain and got all my higher education for free. The state essentially spent large amount of money in me, hoping that I would give it back to the economy as a skilled worker.

After the 2008 crisis I moved like thousands others in my same situation. Now other countries will benefit from the ROI that my home country made on me instead.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#126

Post by iguy » Wed, Oct 24, 2018, 5:54 PM UTC

ransom1538 wrote: post #82

firedrakerage wrote: post #11

I do not typically post, but these suggestions seem like genuine improvements to the existing system: "Kerr suggests allocating H-1Bs not by lottery as they are now, but by salary — the more that a company is willing to pay for a foreign worker, the quicker they can get a visa." "A second change would be to allow H-1B workers to apply for permanent residency green cards on their own, without having to be sponsored by…

I just wish it was reciprocated. I would like to work in Spain (no really). If I work in Spain, the US should open a spot for someone from Spain to work in the US. You want to hire someone from Turkey? No problem, find someone in the US to move to Turkey. You could allow companies to even grease the wheels, "Work from Turkey and get a 30k / year extra free bonus stipend!! yay!!"

Not on a 1-for-1 basis, but something like this is the argument for allowing free movement between comparable countries. If the UK, Canada & Australia opened up to each other, there'd be no massive net flow, but many individuals could work for the most suitable company / near their in-laws / in a climate they like.

This was I think also what was envisaged when the EU first wrote free movement into law -- general mixing, rather than one-directional floods.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#127

Post by jki275 » Wed, Oct 24, 2018, 5:56 PM UTC

georgeburdell wrote: post #113

jki275 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cite please. The current administration has never done anything to show antipathy to legal immigration, the first lady is a legal immigrant as are her parents.

"Muslim ban" affected the ability for Iranians to immigrate. All of the top engineering/science schools in the U.S. lost an entire cohort of Iranian students this past year.

First, there was no "muslim ban", and second the list of countries affected had been defined already by Congress years previous, not the President or the current administration.

Also school visas are not immigrant visas if one wants to be pedantic about it.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#128

Post by jki275 » Wed, Oct 24, 2018, 5:57 PM UTC

damnyou wrote: post #120

jki275 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cite please. The current administration has never done anything to show antipathy to legal immigration, the first lady is a legal immigrant as are her parents.

This is a common misunderstanding. Trump has attacked through policy legal immigration far more than illegal immigration. https://www.afsc.org/blogs/news-and-commentary/trumps-attack...

There's literally no point in trying to support a position like this with a left wing policy blog.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#129

Post by jki275 » Wed, Oct 24, 2018, 5:57 PM UTC

akhilcacharya wrote: post #124

jki275 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cite please. The current administration has never done anything to show antipathy to legal immigration, the first lady is a legal immigrant as are her parents.

She's a white legal immigrant.

yeah yeah racism.

The siren song of those who have no argument.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#130

Post by jorblumesea » Wed, Oct 24, 2018, 5:58 PM UTC

The biggest problem with the H1B visa system is that it's mainly an outsourcing tool. Cognizant, Infosys etc are just offshoring companies and spam the system. The really talented engineers go to the FANGs but these represent a small proportion of visas used.