Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

bloomberg.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

211–220 of 286 posts

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#211

Post by adminu »

pbourke wrote: post #126
makewavesnotwar wrote: post #41

Sure and while you're at it why not implement cameras all over every roadway to automatically ticket you every time you break the speed limit. Or better yet, why not devise a real time geolocation device to be embedded in cars and then lobby for it to be nationally adopted so people literally can't speed? The reality is that very few people want to live in that world and even if we do fully adopt technologies like th…

> The reality is that very few people want to live in that world I suppose I'm in the minority, but I would love to live in a world with fewer impaired drivers and senseless motor vehicle accidents.

Thought further this might lead to a prohibition of manually driven cars and a use of only self-driving cars (talking about the future here).

As allways it boils down to freedom vs. security.

I think, as long as we all live under the same jurisdiction the only way is to find a balance between the more risk averse and the more risk taking people.

We wont find a compromise everyone is happy with, but one that does kind of work for everyone. Not enforcing laws as strictly might calm the moods a little bit where the law goes to far for some.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#212

Post by notahacker »

snarfybarfy wrote: post #173
durkie wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was something that came up shortly after the Snowden documents were released. I don't remember who made the point (maybe Moxie Marlinspike), but they pointed out how important it is to be able to break the law. That breaking the law is an vital means of effecting change in the US: kids smoke pot illegally and grow up to be adults that push to legalize it. Gay people are more and more open and successfully push f…

And what kind of right would breaking the speed limit push that citizens could possible want to have changed? I am all for hardcoded speed limits. Why sell cars that can go faster than $MaxSpeedInYourCountry ??? Other than that I think you made a good point.

Exceeding $MaxSpeedInYourCountry on an empty highway isn't where the majority of speeding related accidents occur, so a basic top speed limiter wouldn't do very much anyway. Not to mention that (at least in Europe) people are likely to take their vehicles to a neighbouring country where different speed legislation applies.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#213

Post by sureaboutthis »

hkjayakumar wrote: post #50
makewavesnotwar wrote: post #41

Sure and while you're at it why not implement cameras all over every roadway to automatically ticket you every time you break the speed limit. Or better yet, why not devise a real time geolocation device to be embedded in cars and then lobby for it to be nationally adopted so people literally can't speed? The reality is that very few people want to live in that world and even if we do fully adopt technologies like th…

> Sure and while you're at it why not implement cameras all over every roadway to automatically ticket you every time you break the speed limit. This actually exists in many cities around the world like Dubai. Probably not every roadway, but almost all major ones.

And Chicago and all over Illinois highways where road construction is underway (though I doubt they actually use them on the highways).

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#214

Post by sureaboutthis »

naveen99 wrote: post #192
makewavesnotwar wrote: post #41

Sure and while you're at it why not implement cameras all over every roadway to automatically ticket you every time you break the speed limit. Or better yet, why not devise a real time geolocation device to be embedded in cars and then lobby for it to be nationally adopted so people literally can't speed? The reality is that very few people want to live in that world and even if we do fully adopt technologies like th…

The cops would revolt as their revenue would disappear or the voters would revolt as taxes would have to be raised to make up for lost ticket revenue. Besides eventually they will track everyone, not just immigrants...

Police departments do not rely on ticket revenue. Cities do. In many cases, a step up in traffic violations is done by a request by a town councilman who may have been pressured by constituents complaining and not revenue.

Source: business contacts with police and relative who is an officer.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#215

Post by king07828 »

ElBarto wrote: post #159
makewavesnotwar wrote: post #41

Sure and while you're at it why not implement cameras all over every roadway to automatically ticket you every time you break the speed limit. Or better yet, why not devise a real time geolocation device to be embedded in cars and then lobby for it to be nationally adopted so people literally can't speed? The reality is that very few people want to live in that world and even if we do fully adopt technologies like th…

> Sure and while you're at it why not implement cameras all over every roadway to automatically ticket you every time you break the speed limit. This is a common and interesting sarcasm. It is interesting because the law is indeed that drivers should get a ticket every time they break the speed limit (or for any other driving offence). These technologies enable the law to be applied absolutely for the first time. The…

Frustration comes from laws and punishments that are optimized for less than 100% enforcement (i.e., harsh punishments for those who actually get caught) being enforced 100% of the time. Laws and punishments should be updated to account for the likelihood of enforcement.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#216

Post by empath75 »

pytyper2 wrote: post #210
durkie wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was something that came up shortly after the Snowden documents were released. I don't remember who made the point (maybe Moxie Marlinspike), but they pointed out how important it is to be able to break the law. That breaking the law is an vital means of effecting change in the US: kids smoke pot illegally and grow up to be adults that push to legalize it. Gay people are more and more open and successfully push f…

Civil disobedience is a real thing, the first example that comes to mind is ignoring laws that require a front license plate, specifically because it reduces the likelihood that your vehicle tag will be caught on camera, those automated ticket system might move on to the next plate if they don't get a scan. I totally agree with you.

That’s not civil disobedience. In civil disobedience you blatantly and publicly violate an unjust law with the intention of being punished so that the public will be repulsed by the injustice of it. I don’t think anyone is going to cry for you if you get a ticket for not having a front plate. You’re doing it to avoid the consequences of a separate illegal act.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#217

Post by AsyncAwait »

pjc50 wrote: post #194
AsyncAwait wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think putting children in cages and having open borders is the only two positions you can hold, you're delusional. Bernie wants a stronger social system in the U.S. If you want universal healthcare, you can't have open borders. But you also don't have to put children in cages. You consider each case, provide asylum if they're in danger, deport if not etc.

Yeah, "Open borders" is a pretty extreme example of "weasel words" that we would spot if it came in a set of product requirements. Does it refer to residency or just to visiting? What's the opposite of an open border, a closed border? Would a closed border with Mexico really mean no travel across it at all, like the Berlin wall? People argue about "health tourism" in the UK system of near-universal healthcare(+), and…

I agree, that "health tourism" isn't really a thing, however my use of the term "open-borders" was in reference to how detractors of universal healthcare, (mostly on the right), in the U.S. straw man it as meaning that it means the entire Latin America moving to the U.S. Putting aside the implied supremacy of the U.S. etc., I just wanted to point out that this is not what people like Bernie are arguing for and is therefore a total strawman.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#218

Post by falcolas »

snarfybarfy wrote: post #173
durkie wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This was something that came up shortly after the Snowden documents were released. I don't remember who made the point (maybe Moxie Marlinspike), but they pointed out how important it is to be able to break the law. That breaking the law is an vital means of effecting change in the US: kids smoke pot illegally and grow up to be adults that push to legalize it. Gay people are more and more open and successfully push f…

And what kind of right would breaking the speed limit push that citizens could possible want to have changed? I am all for hardcoded speed limits. Why sell cars that can go faster than $MaxSpeedInYourCountry ??? Other than that I think you made a good point.

A recent example of where even breaking the speed limit is how laws (or speed limits) are changed:

Recently, our county measured the speed on an 8 mile long rural road. Their conclusion was that there was no need to bump the existing speed limit of 45 up to 55 or 60 (to match similar roads) because people weren't going faster than 45 on it.

Why weren't people going faster than 45 on an empty, rural road? Because the sheriff's department enforced that 45mph speed limit very rigorously, with an average of one speed trap and one roving vehicle.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#219

Post by sheepmullet »

wmccullough wrote: post #191
forapurpose wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Does it likely lead to a place America loses the good parts of its national identity because the amount of people coming in can't be assimilated into our philosophies in our constitution? The people who have most challenged U.S. principles of liberty and democracy, and 'all men are created equal", have been those whose families have been in the U.S. for generations. They've supported slavery, segregation, lynching…

I hear ya. I'm definitely not saying that ideology is right, I'm just saying that I don't think that any side really has a good understanding of the impacts of either decision. I've been careful to not express my own opinion, but I'll share it now, probably to my own detriment. I think that immigration doesn't have to be a polarized thing. The two major sides have done their best to turn this into a polarized issue a…

> As far as losing our national identity, I don't buy that either.

Well there is an easy compromise - for the first two generations immigrants have their vote automatically assigned to the most right wing candidate.

Then the right wing won’t be so worried about losing their voice.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#220

Post by kkarakk »

themistokl1k wrote: post #132

anybody can elaborate on why amazonians can't pull a Google and make them drop the contract?

"amazonians" isn't even a thing. there are various articles about how toxic their work culture is(as ordered from bezos downward). right now i'd say they're like how Microsoft used to be under ballmer except with employees actually treated like kept pets. they argue against each others ideas constantly but anything from the top is taken as sacred law. bezos probably said "I want to get into the surveillance game" and all the poor employees got to work arguing about how best to get there

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2015/08/former-amazon-employe...

Post reply on HN