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Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

phys.org

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Re: Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

#41

Post by A2017U1 »

verelo wrote: post #6
dymk wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But surely terraforming a barren wasteland is going to be easier than terraforming a (relative) oasis of life! But in all seriousness, the point of colonizing Mars is not to be a replacement for Earth (although redundancy is quite motivating). It's because colonization and population growth has been our MO for the last 200,000 years.

But, why fixate on turning one planet into “habitable” while we do the opposite to the one we are already on? I’d like to see us address those issues of society first before we spread our influence across the literal galaxy.

Why try to help sub-Saharan Africa before solving problems in the Western world.

Re: Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

#42

Post by [deleted] »

gizmo686 wrote: post #26
coldnose wrote: post #14

AFAIK, the ability to tolerate oxygen is an advanced property of terrestrial life — the simplest, oldest life forms were totally unable to survive in the presence of oxygen.

The Great Oxygenation Event [0]. Arguably the planet's first mass extinction. To say that nothing we have done to the planet is as bad for the environment as the Great Oxygenation Event would be to pat ourselves on the back for not literally poisoning the atmosphere. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Oxygenation_Event

[deleted]

Re: Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

#43

Post by de_watcher »

verelo wrote: post #6
dymk wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But surely terraforming a barren wasteland is going to be easier than terraforming a (relative) oasis of life! But in all seriousness, the point of colonizing Mars is not to be a replacement for Earth (although redundancy is quite motivating). It's because colonization and population growth has been our MO for the last 200,000 years.

But, why fixate on turning one planet into “habitable” while we do the opposite to the one we are already on? I’d like to see us address those issues of society first before we spread our influence across the literal galaxy.

> But, why fixate on turning one planet into “habitable” while we do the opposite to the one we are already on?

Because we will eventually turn this into an inhabitable and will be needing a new one, you stupid. :D

But seriously, "saving the planet" makes us less likely to expand (expansion needs some gradient where the new place has something better than we have here), so why would life want that?

Re: Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

#44

Post by njarboe »

jacobwilliamroy wrote: post #4

Things I know about Mars: >No oceans >No plants >No phytoplankton >Massive planetwide dust storms lasting several months >Average surface temperatures at or below freezing >Space suit required Things I know about Earth: >Drinking water falls from the sky >Food grows on trees >Breathable atmosphere >Clothing optional in most areas >I can feel actual sunlight on my face every day

Things I know about Mars:

No established legal or social framework.

Things I know about Earth:

Probability of finding a place to be left alone with a small group of like minded people. 0

A certain type of person is interested in living a life where they have a large amount of control over the political and social systems they live with. The American frontier was an ideal place for such people to move to. Many took advantage of the opportunity. This frontier is now closed.

Off Earth is the only viable place for similar frontier to exist and Mars is the best place. It has a ~24hr day, decent gravity(0.38g), Ok solar radiation, H,C,O,N readily available on the surface, and possible terraforming to a open-air livable planet.

Re: Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

#45

Post by short_sells_poo »

verelo wrote: post #6
dymk wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But surely terraforming a barren wasteland is going to be easier than terraforming a (relative) oasis of life! But in all seriousness, the point of colonizing Mars is not to be a replacement for Earth (although redundancy is quite motivating). It's because colonization and population growth has been our MO for the last 200,000 years.

But, why fixate on turning one planet into “habitable” while we do the opposite to the one we are already on? I’d like to see us address those issues of society first before we spread our influence across the literal galaxy.

There is a school of thought that it is only a matter of time until an asteroid or or supervolcano causes another extinction event and unless humanity develops mass spacefaring and colonization capabilities, it won't matter how well we cared for our planet.

I think both efforts are absolutely necessary for the survival of our species.

Re: Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

#46

Post by ElBarto »

njarboe wrote: post #44
jacobwilliamroy wrote: post #4

Things I know about Mars: >No oceans >No plants >No phytoplankton >Massive planetwide dust storms lasting several months >Average surface temperatures at or below freezing >Space suit required Things I know about Earth: >Drinking water falls from the sky >Food grows on trees >Breathable atmosphere >Clothing optional in most areas >I can feel actual sunlight on my face every day

Things I know about Mars: No established legal or social framework. Things I know about Earth: Probability of finding a place to be left alone with a small group of like minded people. 0 A certain type of person is interested in living a life where they have a large amount of control over the political and social systems they live with. The American frontier was an ideal place for such people to move to. Many took ad…

The upper atmosphere of Venus is actually the closest to Earth conditions we have in the solar system.

Just float around in an airtight habitat. Gravity is the same as on Earth, pressure is the same, temperature is 25C. You literally only need to be airtight to keep the noxious atmosphere at bay.

Re: Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

#47

Post by ElBarto »

Apocryphon wrote: post #36
CuriousCosmic wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference I think comes down to a few things. - One is that it is a hell of a lot harder to cheat on Mars than it is in the remotes of Earth. Once you establish the outpost, its not like you can just call in a maintenance team and have assistance at your door within a few days. This forces teams to find ways to make it work. This also makes it much harder for changes in leadership to cancel the mission. - The ot…

To echo the previous post, why Mars? Why not the moon? Why not the Lagrange points? Why not the upper atmosphere of Venus? I'm not saying no to Mars, but there's plenty of other frontiers we should be looking into, some of which are better candidates in terms of proximity or more similar gravity.

Settling on the Moon first would certainly be the more logical and cost effective starting point.

Once all the techs have matured on the Moon then Mars is just a longer trip.

Re: Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

#48

Post by patricklouys »

ElBarto wrote: post #46
njarboe wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Things I know about Mars: No established legal or social framework. Things I know about Earth: Probability of finding a place to be left alone with a small group of like minded people. 0 A certain type of person is interested in living a life where they have a large amount of control over the political and social systems they live with. The American frontier was an ideal place for such people to move to. Many took ad…

The upper atmosphere of Venus is actually the closest to Earth conditions we have in the solar system. Just float around in an airtight habitat. Gravity is the same as on Earth, pressure is the same, temperature is 25C. You literally only need to be airtight to keep the noxious atmosphere at bay.

But where do you get additional resources?

Re: Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

#49

Post by jamesrcole »

ElBarto wrote: post #47
Apocryphon wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To echo the previous post, why Mars? Why not the moon? Why not the Lagrange points? Why not the upper atmosphere of Venus? I'm not saying no to Mars, but there's plenty of other frontiers we should be looking into, some of which are better candidates in terms of proximity or more similar gravity.

Settling on the Moon first would certainly be the more logical and cost effective starting point. Once all the techs have matured on the Moon then Mars is just a longer trip.

Robert Zubrin argues that Mars is a much better target than the Moon. A summary of the argument is in the second paragraph of: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Case_for_Mars#Risks_confro... The full details here: https://www.amazon.com/Case-Mars-Plan-Settle-Planet/dp/14516...

Re: Mars likely to have enough oxygen to support life: study

#50

Post by swarnie_ »

ElBarto wrote: post #46
njarboe wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Things I know about Mars: No established legal or social framework. Things I know about Earth: Probability of finding a place to be left alone with a small group of like minded people. 0 A certain type of person is interested in living a life where they have a large amount of control over the political and social systems they live with. The American frontier was an ideal place for such people to move to. Many took ad…

The upper atmosphere of Venus is actually the closest to Earth conditions we have in the solar system. Just float around in an airtight habitat. Gravity is the same as on Earth, pressure is the same, temperature is 25C. You literally only need to be airtight to keep the noxious atmosphere at bay.

I'll get the Zeppelin...
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