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What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

blog.codinghorror.com

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Re: What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

#181

Post by hahahihi »

School-Cotton wrote: post #141
geezerjay wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's not a solution. Tags are hidden at the bottom of the answer. Yes, it really is. Tags are used to filter results. Stackoverflow specifically lets users run searches only on specific tags, or even exclude certain tags from the search results. As tags reflect technologies and their versions, stackoverflow enables users to run queries only on specific versions.

You're thinking about this from a power-user perspective. 99% of people use Google as the search interface to stack overflow.

SO search is horrible. I sometimes use it by acident then wonder wtf am i doing when the desired result doesn't show.

Re: What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

#182

Post by codinghorror »

Izkata wrote: post #179
codinghorror wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One challenge not discussed here is when an accepted and highly voted answer _used_ to be a good answer, but no longer is in later versions of whatever software/platform/library is discussed. This is also something that gets worse over time, like the uniqueness problem. It's not discussed because the solution is kinda obvious.. wikis mean editing , right? Even by anonymous users? That's also how it works on Stack O…

> Edit the answer to make it better, more up to date This is strongly discouraged because then the existing votes become a lie. > or add a disclaimer at the top that it only applies to very specific versions as needed This I think is allowed, but is extremely rare.

Editing is not strongly discouraged, and adding a disclaimer is not rare.

Re: What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

#183

Post by Izkata »

codinghorror wrote: post #182
Izkata wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Edit the answer to make it better, more up to date This is strongly discouraged because then the existing votes become a lie. > or add a disclaimer at the top that it only applies to very specific versions as needed This I think is allowed, but is extremely rare.

Editing is not strongly discouraged, and adding a disclaimer is not rare.

Editing in general no, changing the answer is. You get rebuked and told to post your own.

Re: What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

#184

Post by manigandham »

EGreg wrote: post #120
manigandham wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's just another "vote" then. What's the point of having answers with a vote and a second if people will just do both? The issue is that relevancy has a time-component, so there needs to be way to age scores as well to make sure the best answer for that time period is at the top.

If there are no new versions, or the new versions have had a tiny uptake, then old answers are relevant!

So what's the problem exactly?

Re: What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

#186

Post by foxfired »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #130
manigandham wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remove the entire concept of "accepted" answers and let votes decay or be withdrawn, along with scoring the rankings using time as an additional input. Quora has recently introduced secondary voting mechanisms where answers will randomly have a "is it still relevant" toggle for users to continue providing signal beyond the initial vote.

I don't mind the Accepted label, however they are sorted at the top by default. They probably should change that to "sort by votes," so the best answer can change over time.

Accepted answers are not necessary at the top. Here is an example: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/6121203/how-to-do-fade-i...

The chosen answer was not the best, so my answer ended up reaching the top. But note that after 7 years, my answer, although still correct, is no longer the most efficient way to do things. Better alternatives are rising up.

Re: What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

#187

Post by jrochkind1 »

codinghorror wrote: post #163
jrochkind1 wrote: post #26

One challenge not discussed here is when an accepted and highly voted answer _used_ to be a good answer, but no longer is in later versions of whatever software/platform/library is discussed. This is also something that gets worse over time, like the uniqueness problem. I think it's worse than the uniqueness problem, multiple duplicate _good_ questions/answers don't actually harm, misguide, or delay anyone looking fo…

> One challenge not discussed here is when an accepted and highly voted answer _used_ to be a good answer, but no longer is in later versions of whatever software/platform/library is discussed. This is also something that gets worse over time, like the uniqueness problem. It's not discussed because the solution is kinda obvious.. wikis mean editing , right? Even by anonymous users? That's also how it works on Stack O…

The solution to dups is obvious too, right? Close em as dups? Yet that is a large focus of the article.

The solution to out-dated answers might be obvious, but apparently obvious isn't stopping it from being a problem... it's a big problem.

If it's obvious, why is it still a problem? If the answer is "because the userbase isn't doing what I want", then _that's_ a problem to which the answer is apparently not obvious. To the extent that SO has been succesful, it is of course that figuring out how to structure the software so as to get the userbase to do useful things _is_ the problem, not an "exersize left to the reader".

Re: What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

#188

Post by jrochkind1 »

geezerjay wrote: post #134
jrochkind1 wrote: post #26

One challenge not discussed here is when an accepted and highly voted answer _used_ to be a good answer, but no longer is in later versions of whatever software/platform/library is discussed. This is also something that gets worse over time, like the uniqueness problem. I think it's worse than the uniqueness problem, multiple duplicate _good_ questions/answers don't actually harm, misguide, or delay anyone looking fo…

> One challenge not discussed here is when an accepted and highly voted answer _used_ to be a good answer, but no longer is in later versions of whatever software/platform/library is discussed. That's not a big problem. Questions and comments can be edited by other users, which includes adding and altering tags that reflect software versions.

I get outdated answers a lot of the time I'm searching. And that's when I can _recognize_ outdated answers. A lot of others posting here say the same. I guess it's possible we're an unrepresentative minority, and it doesn't effect many users.

Otherwise, how is it "not a big problem"? Is it the sort of thing where "in theory" it's not a big problem, even though in actuality it significantly effects the usefulness of the site to many people?

Re: What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

#189

Post by scarface74 »

On the development side, I try to stay away from the bleeding edge and I do as much research as possible, between the two, I’ve never had to ask a technical question on the Internet.

But, I can see the temptation of giving up soon and just posting on SO. I take full advantage of the paid AWS support plan. If I spend more than 30 minutes trying to figure something out, I’ll submit a ticket and wait to chat with someone. So far, AWS support is batting 100.

I don’t think any of my questions have been easy even in hindsight.

Re: What does Stack Overflow want to be when it grows up?

#190

Post by dantiberian »

codinghorror wrote: post #165
kauffj wrote: post #57

StackOverflow being a wiki is at substantial odds with the way answers are selected. If StackOverflow is a wiki, then the best answer to a question should be determined by the community, not the asker, and needs to be able to evolve and change over time. However, StackOverflow simultaneously insists questions can't be duplicated while making answer selection immutable and controlled by the asker. This results in a su…

That's mostly a perk for the question asker. Nobody (that I know of) stops reading at the first answer, because there are usually multiple good ways to solve any problem in programming. And if the accepted answer has a fraction of the upvotes of the answer just under it.. that's another strong signal to "keep scrolling"

People definitely stop reading after the first answer, especially if it looks like a reasonable solution. It is a very common experience for me, where I won't realise that there is a much better rated answer below the accepted one, especially if the top answer is long enough so that the second one isn't visible without scrolling.

From a UX perspective, you want to put the most relevant information at the top. The votes of all Stack Overflow users gives a far greater signal than the one 'accepted' flag from the asker.

This is one of my biggest pain points with Stack Overflow.

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