Live data from Hacker News

OpenBSD 6.4 released

openbsd.org

41–50 of 179 posts

Re: OpenBSD 6.4 released

#41
post #13

Linux is a depressing mess after you've used OpenBSD. Such a high quality system, with stellar documentation. It's unfortunate that Linux has become so popular even though the BSD's are so much better. A bad historical accident. Damn you Linus...

IMHO Linux has the better license. Not sure if I'm in the minority with this opinion?

Re: OpenBSD 6.4 released

#42
post #31
post #13

Linux is a depressing mess after you've used OpenBSD. Such a high quality system, with stellar documentation. It's unfortunate that Linux has become so popular even though the BSD's are so much better. A bad historical accident. Damn you Linus...

I mean, there's no denying that the Linux ecosystem is a mess from a cohesion perspective, but I think it's a bit unfair to come to this conclusion without taking more into account. As far as server operating systems go, nothing is more battletested than Linux today, and nothing really has a more complete offering. OpenBSD is great, of course, but my favorite thing about open source is the cross collaboration. Rather…

> ... though I have a hunch the security story ..

Which makes half of the news today. So, yes, world would be a bit better today if only ..

Re: OpenBSD 6.4 released

#43
post #24
post #13

Linux is a depressing mess after you've used OpenBSD. Such a high quality system, with stellar documentation. It's unfortunate that Linux has become so popular even though the BSD's are so much better. A bad historical accident. Damn you Linus...

Is OpenBSD suitable for use on a laptop? I have a Dell Latitute 7370 running KDE Neon, and it runs really well. All hardware is supported, battery life is on-par with Windows, etc. Would OpenBSD work well on this laptop?

Driver support will always trail behind Linux, so it depends.

Personally, I’d be more interested into having openbsd as the standard for cloud deployments, a place currently inhabited by Ubuntu derivatives. If one could get the declarative goodness of Nix, the popularity of docker, and the reliability / security of openbsd, the world would be a better place.

Re: OpenBSD 6.4 released

#44
post #41
post #13

Linux is a depressing mess after you've used OpenBSD. Such a high quality system, with stellar documentation. It's unfortunate that Linux has become so popular even though the BSD's are so much better. A bad historical accident. Damn you Linus...

IMHO Linux has the better license. Not sure if I'm in the minority with this opinion?

GPL (distribute your code) is better than BSD permissive (do what you want)? For whom?

Re: OpenBSD 6.4 released

#45
post #29
post #13

Linux is a depressing mess after you've used OpenBSD. Such a high quality system, with stellar documentation. It's unfortunate that Linux has become so popular even though the BSD's are so much better. A bad historical accident. Damn you Linus...

"Quality" is a very subjective idea. Yes, docs are easy to keep consistent over long stretches of time if the speed of evolution is slow and a small number of like-minded assiduous gatekeepers can vet every change from a small number of contributors, but since the speed of evolution is slow, OpenBSD for example still has a giant lock protecting most of the kernel -- this despite nearly 2 decades of multicore chips sh…

From the release notes:

sendmsg(2), sendto(2), recvfrom(2) and recvmsg(2) are run without KERNEL_LOCK.

The lock is being removed, slowly with care, piece by piece.

Re: OpenBSD 6.4 released

#46
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a GNUism, so you won't find it in BSD tools.

It's a good GNUism though, that I also wish the BSDs supported. No-one's saying that the BSDs should start supporting GNU style --long-options or switch to info instead of man, but friendlier help messages are always a nice thing.

Strictly speaking, those are usage messages not help messages.

Re: OpenBSD 6.4 released

#47
post #34
post #13

Linux is a depressing mess after you've used OpenBSD. Such a high quality system, with stellar documentation. It's unfortunate that Linux has become so popular even though the BSD's are so much better. A bad historical accident. Damn you Linus...

One thing Linux has going for it is a bunch of popular features for developers' desktops: * Electron apps - VSCode, Atom, Slack, almost every universal desktop app that gets released today. Individual ports of apps to FreeBSD exist, but there is no way to automatically build Electron apps for any of the BSDs. * Good desktop virtualization - KVM, VirtualBox (okay FreeBSD has these in theory), VMware * First-class Dock…

Let’s not forget that MacOS X is considered a BSD by many.

Re: OpenBSD 6.4 released

#48
post #38
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing Linux has going for it is a bunch of popular features for developers' desktops: * Electron apps - VSCode, Atom, Slack, almost every universal desktop app that gets released today. Individual ports of apps to FreeBSD exist, but there is no way to automatically build Electron apps for any of the BSDs. * Good desktop virtualization - KVM, VirtualBox (okay FreeBSD has these in theory), VMware * First-class Dock…

Post hoc ergo propter hoc. All the software you mention is relatively recent (with the exception of VMware arguably) and Linux was ahead of the BSDs in adoption long before these applications were created. Now what exactly created this divide to begin with is a matter of debate but it took place mostly in the 90's and the very early 00's. By the mid 2000's it was clear that BSDs would have a really hard time ever cat…

I've always blamed the licensing. Lots of people adopted BSD and Linux in the early years.

The Linux users gave back (often because they had to) and the BSD users often didn't.

Re: OpenBSD 6.4 released

#49
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, there's no denying that the Linux ecosystem is a mess from a cohesion perspective, but I think it's a bit unfair to come to this conclusion without taking more into account. As far as server operating systems go, nothing is more battletested than Linux today, and nothing really has a more complete offering. OpenBSD is great, of course, but my favorite thing about open source is the cross collaboration. Rather…

> ... though I have a hunch the security story .. Which makes half of the news today. So, yes, world would be a bit better today if only ..

Don't think that security comes at no cost, though. OpenBSD goes a heroic distance to get it's reputation.

Re: OpenBSD 6.4 released

#50

I run OpenBSD as my border firewall which it handles very well. One thing I wish that OpenBSD devs would change in their philosophy is the --help messages. Many commands simply offer a list of switches, as if that's somehow helpful. Sometimes you need the detail in a man page, but a lot of times you don't and it would save so much time and energy to have a succinct list in the --help message itself. # syspatch --help…

That's a GNUism, so you won't find it in BSD tools.

Yeah, but why not adopt it? GNU has done a lot of things right.
Post reply on HN