Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think after 5 years of military service as an officer and a military academy EE degree you could easily obtain very lucrative military contractor work, but of course this is generally going to be in the weapons/electronic warfare sphere which may or may not be ethically compatible to some folks.
The two aren't mutually exclusive; you could easily get contractor work with five years of EE after going to another school (provided you can pass the background and security checks).
Ask HN: Where to go for the cheapest EE degree in the U.S.? In the World?
51–60 of 79 posts
Re: Ask HN: Where to go for the cheapest EE degree in the U.S.? In the World?
#52Tuition fees in public universities are low in France: https://www.campusfrance.org/en/tuition-fees-France For instance, a bachelor degree is 170 euros per year (+ 90 euros of student life and campus service fees). Housing can be expansive in some cities like Paris... For instance, the bachelor degree of EE at Sorbonne université (former Pierre et Marie Curie university before it merged with the historical Sorbonne):…
The rules on this are a bit complicated, though : officially, this price does not apply to anyone who has worked more than two years since their last diploma. Persons in this situation may have to pay thousands of euros (1k/2k per year) to go to a public university. In most cases, the price is covered by some institution (such as "Pole Emploi", which handles unemployment) or by some professional reconversion organiza…
I also know some foreign students in French universities, who went doing masters or PhD and they pay the same as a French student. I doubt it is different for bachelor degrees.
This article from Le Monde implies that they charge foreigners the same price as French students: https://www.lemonde.fr/education/article/2014/11/26/faire-pa...
I think that you speak about "formation continue" in your first paragraph. I think that if you register of your own, you actually get the normal fees. It is only if you qualify for "formation continue" which is more restrictive than being out of school for 2 years. It seems that it means you are funded by Pôle Emploi, or a company etc (see here: https://www.univ-paris8.fr/Formation-continue). So someone who is jobless but not registered as jobless in PôleEmploi can do"formation initiale". Also: https://information-documentation.fr/scolarite/regimes-et-mo... For sure, it does not seem to be very clear.
Re: Ask HN: Where to go for the cheapest EE degree in the U.S.? In the World?
#53(This is a US centric reply, I can't help as much if you are not in the US) So a couple of question to pose first: - Can you live at home? If so, do you plan on living at home? - Are you looking for scholarships? - Are you working while at school? - Why are you going for absolute cheapest? Why not best value? I ask these because they are important questions that will shape what you look for. I hesitate to say "cheape…
>If you go to a crappy college If it's an ABET accredited program, there's a limit to how crappy it can be. Most companies don't care where you went as long as it's ABET accredited. Sure going to a well known school doesn't hurt, but school reputation isn't nearly as big of a problem in engineering as it is for other majors. You should get an internship though, or better yet do a co-op.
Re: Ask HN: Where to go for the cheapest EE degree in the U.S.? In the World?
#54Are you just interested in the lowest up front cost in dollars? I went to the US Military Academy. Tuition, room and board are free, you get a small stipend each month and you have a guaranteed job at graduation. You pay for school with 5 years of service as an Army officer. I was a Mechanical Engineering major, but they have a decent EECS department also. The military academies have an interesting setup where they a…
[0]: http://www.militaryspot.com/national-guard/pay-for-school
Re: Ask HN: Where to go for the cheapest EE degree in the U.S.? In the World?
#55Earlier quoted context omitted.
The rules on this are a bit complicated, though : officially, this price does not apply to anyone who has worked more than two years since their last diploma. Persons in this situation may have to pay thousands of euros (1k/2k per year) to go to a public university. In most cases, the price is covered by some institution (such as "Pole Emploi", which handles unemployment) or by some professional reconversion organiza…
I found the tuition fees on campusfrance, which is the official website for foreign students who wants to go into the French higher education system. They actually state: "The difference is that in France, whether you are French or foreign, the State pays most of the cost." I also know some foreign students in French universities, who went doing masters or PhD and they pay the same as a French student. I doubt it is…
Both my pedagogical (from the university) counseler and the one from Pôle Emploi told me that I was not eligibile to "formation initiale", and that I could only continue studying in "formation continue", since I had already studied, and worked for more than two years. Many people told me the same.
Luckily, I did not listen to them, and still registered, successfully.
I think that many persons (including myself & many public education workers) have a poor understanding of this (admittedly unclear) part of the education code. From my understanding, everyone is eligible to "formation initiale", while some people in a specific situation are eligible to "formation continue", which has been misunderstood as meaning that people that are in this situation are also not eligible to "formation initiale".
Re: Ask HN: Where to go for the cheapest EE degree in the U.S.? In the World?
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
>If you go to a crappy college If it's an ABET accredited program, there's a limit to how crappy it can be. Most companies don't care where you went as long as it's ABET accredited. Sure going to a well known school doesn't hurt, but school reputation isn't nearly as big of a problem in engineering as it is for other majors. You should get an internship though, or better yet do a co-op.
That's a fair point. My worry in the original post is that they only factored in cost as an issue, and if they go to a non-accredited college, then they will likely get a poor ROI.
Re: Ask HN: Where to go for the cheapest EE degree in the U.S.? In the World?
#57The French École Normale Supérieure will pay you around 1200 euros per month to study there. There are strings attached though (10 yrs public service commitment).
French is one of the most difficult Western languages to master, so keep that in mind. Think a year of formal study.
Even for Germany, the visa office typically gives you a German language test that requires you to speak the language well.
If you're one of those people that thinks "I'll pick up a new language on the airplane", you're in for a rude awakening.
Re: Ask HN: Where to go for the cheapest EE degree in the U.S.? In the World?
#58(This is a US centric reply, I can't help as much if you are not in the US) So a couple of question to pose first: - Can you live at home? If so, do you plan on living at home? - Are you looking for scholarships? - Are you working while at school? - Why are you going for absolute cheapest? Why not best value? I ask these because they are important questions that will shape what you look for. I hesitate to say "cheape…
The best piece of this post is hidden in a sentence in the middle, and I wanted to call it out: If cost is an issue, go to a community college BEFORE going to a 4-year engineering school. Community colleges are a fraction of the price of a university. Any EE degree is going to require a significant investment in calculus, some diff eq, linear algebra, chemistry, physics, and likely some humanities. With some clever c…
Re: Ask HN: Where to go for the cheapest EE degree in the U.S.? In the World?
#59Germany is a solid choice. Far better conditions than in some neighbouring countries (cough cough France). Depending on the state (Bundesland), the fees can be very low to none. Again state-dependant, but in many cases foreign students must lock a yearly amount into a bank account and can only withdraw 1/12 or so each month. Quite rightly so: unless you're a monk, you'll need a bit more than they force you to lock up. Bachelor level is almost exclusively in German (exceptions may exist) and I suggest learning German: there are specific avenues granting university access and it's an investment of 6 months to 1 year at least. Living expenses are fairly low from my perspective.
Canada is a good choice because even if most foreign students pay _much_ more than Canadians or provincial residents, it's still several times cheaper than the equivalent in the US. What I've seen in Québec is of very high quality. Language (French or English) depends on the university. Linguistic questions aside, and here I speak specifically of Québec (other provinces may vary), you may be obliged to complete a series of pre-university college classes to bring your maths to level. The university generally offers these. Living expenses are probably a bit higher than Germany but still comparable.
Other things to consider, especially since we're talking about engineering: recognition and professional orders. Recognition: diplomas from countries known as diploma mills are like a stone around the neck whereas diplomas from others are generally well regarded. Professional orders: if engineering jobs in your target work country require membership in a professional order and your diploma is foreign, well, good luck with that -- in the best case, it can take months to join, in the worst case, they make you take corrective classes.
Finally, medium term. When you need a job. Canada vs Germany is a harder question. I changed careers and moved between the two so my perspective is skewed. I know that an EE diploma in Germany will definitely get you a good first job that will teach you a lot. The thing is, unless you're German, you're unlikely to want to stay there (some odd cultural issues, high taxes, relatively low salaries for talented people -- those are the general complaints of, let's say, North American and European foreigners). Canada has a relatively good labour market with better social protection than the southern neighbour. If you work in Canada, flexible people tend to fit in quickly (unless problems with the linguistic divide), but the taxes are also very high in some places, starting salaries are sad, and the brain drain to the US is unfortunately real. The winter in most parts is highly subjective.
Re: Ask HN: Where to go for the cheapest EE degree in the U.S.? In the World?
#60Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm not looking for a piece of paper, no. I'm looking for a hands-on learning experience with competent instructors, and the collegiality of classmates. The instructors don't have to be Harvard or MIT grade (note that electrons will still flow in the ways electrons flow regardless of if I learn those ways from a Harvard or MIT Professor, or someone else). I'm just a value shopper for education, nothing more, nothing…
You can arguably learn more about the practice of EE from Dave Jones' YouTube channel, or local hardware Meetups, or "The Amp Hour" than college classes. And those are free. And go spend a couple of hundred bucks on Horowitz and Hill (2nd or 3rd Ed.) if you want to learn about analog. That's a good bang for the buck. In the traditional path, your best bet will be spending your last two years at an abet accredited sta…
An example: this morning I was thinking of a model where I need to open and close a door when a sensor is activated. The simplest way would be for it to pivot on a horizontal axis like an old-school garage door. Now, given a certain weight of door, how do I calculate the amount of torque my motor/drive-train needs in order to open that door?
The average graduate with an EE degree should have no trouble getting the answer in a few minutes: it's basic physics and algebra (maybe calculus if you want precision). But the average person who learned EE from watching YouTube channels probably will have difficulty.