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Ask HN: Over 60 = no engineering jobs?

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Re: Ask HN: Over 60 = no engineering jobs?

#81

Post by shakkhar »

gambler wrote: post #66

>If you were hiring, can you tell me why you might not even do a phone interview? Ph.D. in AI will probably scare off anyone who has a typical business app development or integration job. It's just hard to imagine someone with this level of education grinding out bugs in garbage legacy code, or calling vendors to ask why their SOAP web service doesn't work according to documentation. Now, whether you would even care…

Exactly the first thing that came to my mind. OP may be overqualified for the jobs he is applying for. Your run-of-the-mill AI startup doesn't have any suitable problem for a Ph.D.

Yes, the OP happens to be 60. But there is no reason to speculate ageism based on just that. May be he / she has a 4-page resume. May be he is applying to series A start-ups. May be OP has switched a few jobs in quick succession recently. Too many unknowns to provide any answer.

Re: Ask HN: Over 60 = no engineering jobs?

#82

Post by joewee »

klaw123 wrote: post #39
mchannon wrote: post #4

One theory: The Bay Area has become seriously ageist. Many people have a hard time accepting working for someone a generation younger than them, and especially hiring a subordinate a generation older than them. The people reviewing your resume and interviewing you won't say it (they're not allowed to by law) but they'll definitely be thinking it, and it ends up being a huge waste of your time. I genuinely think it's…

There are companies that take this the other way. Companies where everyone is over 40 and has kids. And stability of the prod systems is highly prized. Nobody wants hackathons , we all leave at 5:30pm each day. These companies exist in Bay Area.

Care to list a few for those who might be looking for something like that?

Re: Ask HN: Over 60 = no engineering jobs?

#83

Post by [deleted] »

nnash wrote: post #41
duxup wrote: post #8

Heck I'm only over 40. I did a handful of interviews at places where folks who I went to school with also interviewed. I got a lot of "culture" questions. My younger classmates, did not hear the world "culture" in their interviews, ever. It's hard not to be pessimistic and assume "culture" was about age...

Try being a minority, and consistently get rejected because you aren't a good "culture fit" on an all white team. edit: I didn't mean to sound like I was trivializing your experience. The "culture fit" is really nasty and sucks for everyone who isn't "the norm".

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Over 60 = no engineering jobs?

#84

Post by joewee »

duxup wrote: post #8

Heck I'm only over 40. I did a handful of interviews at places where folks who I went to school with also interviewed. I got a lot of "culture" questions. My younger classmates, did not hear the world "culture" in their interviews, ever. It's hard not to be pessimistic and assume "culture" was about age...

“Culture” is a catch all for lack of rapport. Either because of their biases or our own. Which is fine for me, I probably wouldn’t have liked working with them if the most significant finding they come away from the interview is that I want to go home at a reasonable hour or I’m not a sports fan. Lol. Finding a good job fit takes time unfortunately. Having a network helps, because you probably already have shared values.

Perhaps focus on rapport at the start of your interviews?

Re: Ask HN: Over 60 = no engineering jobs?

#85

Post by khalilravanna »

rb808 wrote: post #34
docker_up wrote: post #22

Anything more than 10 years old on your resume is worthless. Yes, you may have 3 STEM undergrad degrees, but no one cares because it's not relevant anymore. What modern technologies have you recently worked with? What does your resume show, 20 years at the same company, or do you have experience at well-known, "prestigous" companies like FANG? Are you pigeon-holed into a specific area, or are you a generic, back-end…

> rolodex of former coworkers that I routinely have lunch with still and can ask for jobs, etc Yeah this is an important thing everyone should be doing. I used to be shy about this but everyone is in the same boat and most do appreciate a quick drink or meal every few years to network, even if you're not friends.

Even if this wasn't a great tool for networking, it's at the very least a great tool for being happy. I love catching up with old coworkers and I'm only 27-- I'm excited to see how many I have when I'm older. Coincidentally, I just got a drink with an old VP of eng. last night and spent a good portion of the time asking about all my other former coworkers. It's wonderful to hear all the crazy, interesting things people are doing after they leave your personal bubble of perception.

Re: Ask HN: Over 60 = no engineering jobs?

#87

Post by gargarplex »

joewee wrote: post #61
RangerScience wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He said not to put dates on degrees, but could you also not put dates on jobs, just durations?

You need dates on jobs because they want to identify gaps in employment. The only exception would be if you are a contractor and all of the engagements were under your company. You would list the start and end of your consulting practice in that case.

I've screened thousands of resumes and I've never searched for gaps in employment. Some companies may do this but I haven't witnessed it. The things I search for all things obviously within a person's control: consistent formatting, sane file format & filename, and flawless grammar.

Re: Ask HN: Over 60 = no engineering jobs?

#88

Post by justinhj »

joewee wrote: post #84
duxup wrote: post #8

Heck I'm only over 40. I did a handful of interviews at places where folks who I went to school with also interviewed. I got a lot of "culture" questions. My younger classmates, did not hear the world "culture" in their interviews, ever. It's hard not to be pessimistic and assume "culture" was about age...

“Culture” is a catch all for lack of rapport. Either because of their biases or our own. Which is fine for me, I probably wouldn’t have liked working with them if the most significant finding they come away from the interview is that I want to go home at a reasonable hour or I’m not a sports fan. Lol. Finding a good job fit takes time unfortunately. Having a network helps, because you probably already have shared val…

I agree with your points entirely, but "culture fit" is a very ugly thing when used to exclude people that cannot be legally discriminated against. There's a reason these employment laws exist; people have a right to a job they are qualified to do regardless of whether they share the hobbies or opinions of the interview team.

Re: Ask HN: Over 60 = no engineering jobs?

#90

Post by pmoriarty »

Have you tried trimming your resume so that only some of your most recent work experience is on it?

You could also try removing school graduation dates or any other hints of your age.

If after all that you're still not getting interviews, then the fault can't be with how old you are.

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