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Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

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Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#21
post #19

What's the point? "Power on to BASIC" is running an app on an old small OS. What's wrong with running any programming environment app fullscreen on a modern computer?

It introduces a vastly larger number of elements to a new mind much more quickly.

Comparing opening Windows 10 and VS and starting a new project to turning on a computer and being presented an in-line-text IDE is to introduce degrees of complexity greater than is needed to understand or teach the fundamental concept (programming).

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#22

Raspberry PI cab be said to be evolved from a ~ power-on-to-BASIC computer; to wit: the (BBC) Acorn Archimedes. You can still get RISC OS for it even. Basically, you power on; hit F12; *BASIC >_ and bob's your uncle: you get a nice BBC BASIC prompt at the bottom of your screen. https://www.riscosopen.org/content/downloads/raspberry-pi (that said, why not use pi + python? It's the new BASIC. And it supports turtle gra…

Yes. Raspberry Pi plus RISC OS Pico will drop you straight into a BASIC prompt. And one which is largely compatible with software written the original BBC BASIC from the early 1980s, if you have that nostalgia. The embedded assembler is ARM rather than 6502, and there are improvements and changes to some of the OS interfaces, but most simple stuff will work unchanged.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#23

The closest thing I've found to this is Pico-8: not a computer, a piece of software, but it's very cool. It has a simple text editor for writing Lua code, a simple sprite editor, and a simple sound editor, all for creating games. It's a nice little sandbox for playing with code and creating things. https://www.lexaloffle.com/pico-8.php

I upvoted this but I need to reiterate my support.

When I was a kid, I was heavily into video games and had a burning desire to create my own. However, the options for doing so were not great. One of my middle school teachers tried to introduce us to programming via creating Space Invaders in perl, which went as well as you might imagine. There were a few GUI game making applications that were all terrible and extremely limited. I eventually managed to make a game using Flash, but all the overhead of arcane Actionscript APIs was overwhelming and discouraging. I stopped programming and for several years thought I was going to go into media, creating films and animation. I eventually picked up programming again in college, but there were many years of programming experience I could have had if I had stuck with game dev.

I'm convinced that if PICO-8 existed when I was originally interested in making games, I never would have stopped programming. PICO-8 is the perfect balance of easy-to-learn and powerful. Lua is a good first language because it's so small, and encourages you to build your own solutions rather than rely on magical libraries. For example, I never knew how a list-shuffling algorithm (Fisher-Yates) worked until I needed to write my own because Lua and PICO-8 don't provide one.

The limited sprite and sound options encourage you to spend time not on the assets but on the gameplay (the code). It's quick to get things on screen and working because the PICO-8 API is simple, logical, and not arcane (cough Actionscript cough).

Basically, it introduces programming in an instant-gratification way that's able to grab and hold a child's attention, while still being powerful enough to produce games that aren't hamstrung by toy programming languages.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#24
Duinomite: https://www.olimex.com/Products/Duino/Duinomite/DUINOMITE-MI...

You'll need a keyboard with PS/2 connector and a monitor/tv with a VGA port. And it does "power on to BASIC."

Cheap too...20 EUR.

There's also a "mega" version with added USB and composite video: https://www.olimex.com/Products/Duino/Duinomite/DUINOMITE-ME...

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#26
post #12

"power on to genera" would be nice.

One of these days somebody needs to find the email addresses of the people that need emailing and make the effort to politely pester and track the progress of opening Genera.

I'm interested enough but can't guarantee low enough email latency on my end of staying in touch.

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#28
The Kano kits come to mind in spirit, Though it's more of a guided cushier approach than just getting into basic. The basic idea is a Pi and it's accessories that you "build yourself" and then some optional add ons like a light grid display.

I think the actual coding Python and Javascript with a block formatting kind of like lego Mindstorms. Come to think of it you can use Small Basic on Mindstorms which might be interesting.

For the Kano the coding portion is web based and free if you want to take it for a spin, as well as their OS.

https://world.kano.me/coding-challenges/training

https://kano.me/store/us/products/computer-kit

Re: Ask HN: Is there a modern “power on to basic” computer, for kids to learn on?

#30
post #10

Depending on their age, for young kids best results I've had are Pi's (or old/cheap pc's) that boot straight into scratch. Far better results than an intimidating command prompt. https://scratch.mit.edu/ Alternatively Pi's (or old/cheap pc's) that boot straight into Minecraft Eduction Edition: https://education.minecraft.net This has paths for the very young in minecraft itself to older kids using ide's.

I second this. My kids love scratch. It shows them event driven programming with quick returns. The can also share their apps and download others so they can download and modify.
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