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Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

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Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#111

Post by jogjayr »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #101
jogjayr wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The converse view is that problem solvers emerge because we keep making dire predictions. The best way to motivate people (especially bright people) is to convince them their work has higher meaning. If a problem being solved isn't high-stakes, you won't have the best and brightest working on it. They are going to go work on something that is actually high-stakes, high-impact. The post-WW2 nuclear threat was real. It…

Geniuses don't need the masses to advise them what matters. They can figure it out for themselves and are frequently ignored for long periods. Einstein worked in a patent office for years, unable to get the university job he longed for. It took two tries of photographing a solar eclipse to finally get proof of his theory and once proof existed, he was world famous overnight. He didn't stick with it because the masses…

Good point about Einstein. It's true that bright minds also go after problems they think are important, regardless of what everyone else thinks.

Haranguing masses can decide what gets funded. Einstein's research didn't need much money, which worked out well for him. What if his genius had been in something that required more capital?

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#112

Post by xupybd »

pjc50 wrote: post #106
xupybd wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we can get renewables cheaper than fossil fuels and get reasonable energy storage politics won’t be a problem.

This absolutely can be a problem, because infrastructure needs political approval. Worst case is a ban on renewable generation to protect fossil fuel profits, for example.

You are correct but if we can get to the point that economics drive green energy the political opponents will have trouble stopping it.

There is a tipping point in there that we could be prevented from hitting, but I really don't think that will happen.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#113

Post by jsingleton »

vjsc wrote: post #78

In my opinion, the large corporations behind fossil fuels have too much of an economic clout. The governments around the world are dependent on them for a considerable amount of their respective national economy. So yes you are right about government not doing much about this. Ultimately, unless there is a relatively quick mass extinction event, no government is going to be bothered into action. Climate change and th…

Depressingly pragmatic. While building resilience is certainly worthwhile, we can still fix this and should try.

I think individual actions can add up, particularly when we use the magnifying power of tech. I wrote a lot on this recently and I can't fit it all in a comment so I'll just link to it.

https://unop.uk/how-to-help-with-a-big-global-problem-as-a-t...

It boils down to a three step process:

- Understand

- Organise

- Amplify

There's a post for each and more to come.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#114

Post by Theodores »

starbugs wrote: post #84
brylie wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We keep trying to shift accountability from ourselves to technology. It is our responsibility to change our lifestyles now. Not in a generation when some hypothetical technical savior may emerge and deliver us from danger.

It's our technology. We made it. We are responsible. I don't see your point. What do you want people to do? Stop living their lives and give up tech? To what level? Can we keep the wheel? That's not how things work in reality.

Previous civilisations have given up the wheel. The Japanese did, then in the Middle East the wheel went by the wayside where animals rather than wheels suited the compact cities.

Just saying that because some people don't understand that there are good reasons to give up those clumsy wheel things, they ain't the bees knees.

In the post nuclear war movie 'Threads' there is a quick loss of education and language in the nuclear winter years. A girl is shown with a record player and records, this scene is about how the girl has no idea what this is for, the very culture of music is not conceivable, it has been lost.

All tech is given up in the apocalypse. As is language and civilisation. It becomes a life of harsh survival. Violence becomes the universal language that everyone understands, that's it.

This is still an outcome our politicians have not gone to rule out for us. With our taxes we pay for tens of thousands of nuclear weapons to be pointed at us.

If we just give up the cult of militarism then we will be fine.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#115

Post by tralarpa »

starbugs wrote: post #79
cthulha wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems like a psychological defence against anxiety/depression rather than an actual foundation for real action. You're looking at big, broad patterns and assuming they will work out on the huge scales necessary for civilisation to continue. Other people are looking at the big broad patterns and assuming that cascading failures will make problems accelerate.

No, it's not. It's a mindset and a positive attitude that is constructive instead of spreading fear and doom, which does not yield any positive outcome at all.

> spreading fear and doom, which does not yield any positive outcome at all.

That's not true. You are keeping saying that in several of your comments. There are many examples where things have changed because of

  Spreading fear and doom -> Politicians pass laws -> Industry is forced to react -> New technologies developed/deployed/...
What you and some others here are proposing is basically to wait that things crash and then directly jump to the "New technologies" part. Like a child waiting for christmas.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#116

Post by aoner »

If you look at the recent IPCC reports, people are heavily betting on putting carbon back into the stable form. That can be in the form of carbon capture storage, or creating new building materials or other stuff out of it. I think in the near future, people will pay a hefty premium for carbon storage due to carbon taxes (Check out this great GIF that illustrates carbon tax scheme growth: https://www.sightline.org/2017/06/06/map-the-future-is-carbo... ). Together, these carbon pricing initiatives cover about 7 gigatons of carbon dioxide equivalent (GtCO2e), or about 13 percent of annual global GHG emissions. I think this will create a huge business, so if you are an engineer, I think it makes sense to get involved.

Personally the state of the world has given me a lot of negativity, but I've turned that around after doing a lot of research. There is a lot of awesome work being done.

There are a couple of good resources to see what everybody else is already doing: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1xc6lkrIv1XORl7b31ARq... https://www.thirdway.org/graphic/carbon-capture-projects-map http://www.airminers.org/explore

I'm very interested in this space, and think there are a lot of other people interested (just as Ycombinator is in its request for carbon removal technologies: https://www.ycombinator.com/rfs/#carbon ). I have more resources if people are interested.

(On a personal level, I've also made a lot of changes. I stopped eating meat, and renovated our home to be sustainable, by adding a air to water heat pump, solar panels, a solar boiler, an heat recovery system for our shower, ventilation based on CO2 levels so only the necessary heat escapes and of course better insulation. I'm also thinking about creating an excel of my carbon footprint yearly and trying to reduce it/compensate it)

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#117

Post by jsingleton »

King-Aaron wrote: post #92

Unfortunately at an individual level effecting change, I feel the boat has long since sailed. It's pretty obvious that in western democracies, it's not so much the politicians who control the scene, but the corporates that sponsor their election campaigns in return for industry specific kickbacks. While we have vested interests such as coal, oil and gas producers sponsoring your only valid political choices, you're g…

There is lots of action still required to reach your realistic scenario. Don't give up. You can help.

Hopefully this can motivate people in an optimistic way: https://unop.uk/how-to-help-with-a-big-global-problem-as-a-t...

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#118

Post by maym86 »

On a personal note, don't have children. I'm not being facetious. It seems like we've had opportunities to do the right thing and consistently haven't so until the outlook looks better and we start taking action it's not a great idea to create offspring that will have to deal with the consequences.

Re: Ask HN: What can be done to prevent a climate catastrophe?

#119

Post by spuz »

pjc50 wrote: post #106
xupybd wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we can get renewables cheaper than fossil fuels and get reasonable energy storage politics won’t be a problem.

This absolutely can be a problem, because infrastructure needs political approval. Worst case is a ban on renewable generation to protect fossil fuel profits, for example.

As soon as renewables become more profitable than fossil fuels any (personal) economic incentive politicians have to subsidise the fossil fuel industry will switch to the renewable industry. Even the most corrupt politicians you could imagine are not so hell bent on destroying the planet that they would refuse bribes from their friends in the solar industry.

The real political incentive behind fossil fuel subsidy comes down to technology and economics. The reality is that every nation is dependent on oil and gas and without them their economies would be destroyed. The real reason politicians fear a real push towards cleaner energy is that it will increase energy prices enough to trigger nationwide riots and protests.

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