Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival • Hacker News Board

Re: Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival

#121

Post by stevenjohns » Sun, Oct 07, 2018, 11:13 PM UTC

village-idiot wrote: post #85

When I was much younger, I thought that adults didn’t know how to use new tech, and that’s why they didn’t bother with new fangled tech like Facebook. Now that I’m closing in on my 30th birthday, I realize I had it all wrong. I can use snapchat, I just don’t understand why I would want to use it. I’m curious what Snapchat will do to try and entice people like me into using it. From where I sit, I’m having a very hard…

Snapchat filled a niche that sat between directly messaging your friend/family group and putting something on display on Facebook. You could share random thoughts, things that happened in your day or interesting things you come across.

It was walled version of Twitter with a focus on photo and video.

What made it really interesting for me is that, because it uses your phone book to gather your contacts, you end up with a somewhat different circle to who you might have on Facebook. There were some people I hadn't spoken to for years, or people who were in my friends circle that I didn't talk to much, that became some of my most-interacted with people on Snapchat.

Re: Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival

#122

Post by Blackthorn » Sun, Oct 07, 2018, 11:19 PM UTC

sireat wrote: post #95

asmithmd1 wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> then the board should absolutely give him the boot in the next 24 months. Very funny, Snapchat has two classes of stock and he owns enough of the kind that matters that no one can oust him. I looked through the S-1 when they were going public and decided owning the shares they were selling to the public was the equivalent of a "board observer" seat. You are free to watch him run his company, but it is still his com…

The sad thing is that it applies to many other companies these days, most notably Facebook, Google et al. Why do people buy common shares which give them no voting rights as a shareholder? Sure while company is minting money (or debt and marketshare) you can find a greater fool to offload your shares. However when things turn the Zynga way, what recourse do you have with these no vote shares? At least Bond holders an…

> Why do people buy common shares which give them no voting rights as a shareholder?

Because you believe in the people who have the voting rights?

Let's get real here: for those of us buying stock with voting rights, we don't really have voting rights. The proportion we have is so vanishingly small it's the same as not having voting rights in the first place.

Re: Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival

#123

Post by dannyw » Sun, Oct 07, 2018, 11:40 PM UTC

agorabinary wrote: post #96

iamleppert wrote: post #16

They had a working thing and then ruined it. I’m not sure how they managed to do that with a product change. Didn’t they have a way to release changes and measure impact before just forcing it on their entire user base? Once a company gets to this level, they need to recognize the role that luck played into their original product and design. They hit a resonance with people, and it was probably more luck and timing t…

Did they ever reverse the product redesign back to the original design? Haven't really used Snapchat at all but curious to know, thanks

They completely reverted some small changes, and partially reverted more changes. But it wasn't a clean reverse; I still prefer the old snapchat to the new.

I genuinely believe the best path forward for Snapchat is to completely reset back to pre-redesign as a way of making amends to all the users that left, and then re-designing again from there with their new focus.

Re: Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival

#124

Post by asmithmd1 » Sun, Oct 07, 2018, 11:41 PM UTC

Blackthorn wrote: post #122

sireat wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sad thing is that it applies to many other companies these days, most notably Facebook, Google et al. Why do people buy common shares which give them no voting rights as a shareholder? Sure while company is minting money (or debt and marketshare) you can find a greater fool to offload your shares. However when things turn the Zynga way, what recourse do you have with these no vote shares? At least Bond holders an…

> Why do people buy common shares which give them no voting rights as a shareholder? Because you believe in the people who have the voting rights? Let's get real here: for those of us buying stock with voting rights, we don't really have voting rights. The proportion we have is so vanishingly small it's the same as not having voting rights in the first place.

Exactly, Just like democracy is the same as a dictator

Re: Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival

#125

Post by dannyw » Sun, Oct 07, 2018, 11:43 PM UTC

anilshanbhag wrote: post #34

Lost in all this is an important distinction that Snapchat wanted to make: they wanted to separate friends from influencers / celebrities / media. It was a good change. Another important thing Snapchat does is it doesn't show likes / followers publicly - when the whole world is chasing these numbers Snapchat has taken stance against it. The general philosophy they follow makes me think this is short term pain and the…

I'd love to hear why you think that separating friends from influencers, celebrity, or media is a good change. The last element I get somewhat, but I don't think anyone has a conceptual issue identifying who is a fried and who is an influencer, and being able to see stories with minimal friction was a major draw for me.

Re: Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival

#126

Post by everdev » Sun, Oct 07, 2018, 11:44 PM UTC

askafriend wrote: post #33

iamleppert wrote: post #16

They had a working thing and then ruined it. I’m not sure how they managed to do that with a product change. Didn’t they have a way to release changes and measure impact before just forcing it on their entire user base? Once a company gets to this level, they need to recognize the role that luck played into their original product and design. They hit a resonance with people, and it was probably more luck and timing t…

I think you hit the nail on the head here. There were reports that came out from several sources that Evan ignored all feedback from product and design including hard numbers from early tests. There were apparently several groups internally that tried to stop the massive changes from dropping without adequate testing and iteration. Those groups were overridden by Evan in favor of "vision" and that apparent lack of di…

There's multiple legends of CEOs famously shunning the rational advice of their team and charging down a path they believe in. You're a genius if it works out (ie. Steve Jobs) and second guessed if it doesn't.

Re: Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival

#127

Post by sseveran » Sun, Oct 07, 2018, 11:53 PM UTC

Animats wrote: post #108

sireat wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sad thing is that it applies to many other companies these days, most notably Facebook, Google et al. Why do people buy common shares which give them no voting rights as a shareholder? Sure while company is minting money (or debt and marketshare) you can find a greater fool to offload your shares. However when things turn the Zynga way, what recourse do you have with these no vote shares? At least Bond holders an…

I think we're going to see less of that. A few companies with founder control through multiple classes of stock have screwed up badly. It's now a negative with investors. For many decades, the New York Stock Exchange refused to list stocks that had multiple classes of stock, except for a few companies such as Ford Motor that were grandfathered in. But they no longer have enough clout to make that stick. Google and Fa…

The big change is that S&P is no longer going to consider adding companies with structures like this to the S&P 500. Existing companies got grandfathered in.

Re: Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival

#128

Post by squaresmile » Mon, Oct 08, 2018, 12:04 AM UTC

Animats wrote: post #108

sireat wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sad thing is that it applies to many other companies these days, most notably Facebook, Google et al. Why do people buy common shares which give them no voting rights as a shareholder? Sure while company is minting money (or debt and marketshare) you can find a greater fool to offload your shares. However when things turn the Zynga way, what recourse do you have with these no vote shares? At least Bond holders an…

I think we're going to see less of that. A few companies with founder control through multiple classes of stock have screwed up badly. It's now a negative with investors. For many decades, the New York Stock Exchange refused to list stocks that had multiple classes of stock, except for a few companies such as Ford Motor that were grandfathered in. But they no longer have enough clout to make that stick. Google and Fa…

Aren't both Google and Facebook on NASDAQ and not NYSE? Anyway, I can't also find any reference to NYSE refusing to list dual class shares so I would be grateful if you can point me to some resources.

Re: Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival

#129

Post by hazz99 » Mon, Oct 08, 2018, 12:04 AM UTC

profalseidol wrote: post #115

tigershark wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly, I was going to write the same thing, although with a small, but perhaps quite important correction: “You are free to watch him ru i n his company, but it is still his company”

And ruin the lives of it's employees. Long live our most honorable Capital Feudal Lords!

I think if they work at Snap then they can find work at other companies, I wouldn't say their lives are 'ruined'

Re: Snapchat CEO’s leaked memo on survival

#130

Post by xraystyle » Mon, Oct 08, 2018, 12:15 AM UTC

everdev wrote: post #126

askafriend wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you hit the nail on the head here. There were reports that came out from several sources that Evan ignored all feedback from product and design including hard numbers from early tests. There were apparently several groups internally that tried to stop the massive changes from dropping without adequate testing and iteration. Those groups were overridden by Evan in favor of "vision" and that apparent lack of di…

There's multiple legends of CEOs famously shunning the rational advice of their team and charging down a path they believe in. You're a genius if it works out (ie. Steve Jobs) and second guessed if it doesn't.

The problem here is that Evan isn't Steve Jobs so much as he's just cargo-culting Steve Jobs without really understanding why Jobs was successful. Steve was able to see untapped markets, holes that could be filled by new products, completely different ways of doing things.

Most of Apple's biggest successes were had by coming up with something completely new and novel, not by ignoring user feedback when iterating on an existing product.