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Google DeepMind Founder Demis Hassabis: Three Truths about AI

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Re: Google DeepMind Founder Demis Hassabis: Three Truths about AI

#81

Post by AnimalMuppet »

lordfoom wrote: post #63
qubax wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is on track to end civilization as we know it within two generations. The reason why so many people don't take climate change seriously is because of extreme hyperbole like this. Climate change is outdoing even the "peak oil" craze of the past. If you think civilization is going to end in 40 years ( 2 generations ), then you leave no room for debate. > A rational society would think about nothing else. No. A rat…

>If you think civilization is going to end in 40 years ( 2 generations ), then you leave no room for debate. And yet, here you are, debating him, while the world gets hotter and the weather more extreme.

Yes, because qubax does not believe that civilization is going to end in 40 years. "The world getting hotter and the weather more extreme" != "the end of civilization in 40 years".

Re: Google DeepMind Founder Demis Hassabis: Three Truths about AI

#83

Post by adrianN »

lixtra wrote: post #62
adwhit wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well that's OK then (???)

Yes, learn to accept your mortality. Long term the human race will die. Some think by robots taking over. Some think by earth getting as warm as it has not been a long time much faster than ever (although live was thriving at that time). Some think a bit meteor might hit us or a super volcano could erupt and cause 100 years of darkness. Some think a global nuclear war will end us. Some think humans will just procreat…

In the very long term we're all dead. That doesn't mean that we shouldn't actively work to prevent that for as long as possible. Just because you'll die of old age at some point it's not okay for me to torture you to death.

Re: Google DeepMind Founder Demis Hassabis: Three Truths about AI

#84

Post by dmreedy »

Great, I hope he's right.

However, the AI that has panned out so far (whatever subset of the Hard Problem of Consciousness we've been able to...I don't really want to say solve. Address? Attempt?) in the current summer has done very little to further any of these goals, and has done quite a bit to advance many of the aspects he's worrying about.

So when are we going to start seeing evidence that these kinds of lofty prophecies will pan out? Or is the idea that it's going to arrive all at once like the Messiah, and save us from ourselves. I'm very excited about and deeply interested in Artificial Intelligence the discipline. Artificial Intelligence the Religion, I could do without.

Re: Google DeepMind Founder Demis Hassabis: Three Truths about AI

#85

Post by Notorious_BLT »

adwhit wrote: post #49

I always find it strange to hear people talk about climate change as if it is some sort of tricky challenge we need to solve, like improving education or curing cancer. It is a 'problem' of completely different magnitude. It is on track to end civilization as we know it within two generations. A rational society would think about nothing else. Our children will be astonished and mystified - and furious - to see all t…

So, as someone apparently aware of the problem on a level higher than most of humanity, and so confident that we should be thinking of nothing else, what are you doing daily to resolve the problem? Are all of your resources and time allocated to solving this?

Obviously the answer is no, and probably for the same reasons as everyone else: people have other things going on in their lives.

Re: Google DeepMind Founder Demis Hassabis: Three Truths about AI

#86

Post by smallnamespace »

mindcrime wrote: post #75
adwhit wrote: post #49

I always find it strange to hear people talk about climate change as if it is some sort of tricky challenge we need to solve, like improving education or curing cancer. It is a 'problem' of completely different magnitude. It is on track to end civilization as we know it within two generations. A rational society would think about nothing else. Our children will be astonished and mystified - and furious - to see all t…

Our children will be astonished and mystified - and furious - to see all the things we got up to instead of dealing with this thing that is the only thing that matters. That's been happening since Generation X kids were old enough to understand what a mess our parents made of the world. Unfortunately we haven't done a very good job of making a difference. Frankly I'm a little disappointed in my cohort in that regard.…

To tackle big problems, you need the structures in place to organize people, lead them, figure out not just the grand goal but the sub-objectives to be met, and to reward those who contribute and punish cheaters, and also the money and resources to do all of those things above.

But at this point you're no longer talking about getting a diffuse group of people together who believe in the same thing, but building something like a corporation or an NGO. That can easily take half a lifetime and a lot of perseverance. Most people don't have the time, energy, or money to go that route.

Re: Google DeepMind Founder Demis Hassabis: Three Truths about AI

#87

Post by adrianN »

glitchc wrote: post #80
TeMPOraL wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Frankly, I can't really understand how come people believe what you just wrote. Yes, technology created many problems, but we can't solve them by doing less technology, without reintroducing problems we've already solved. We can either not solve them, or try to solve it with more progress (likely introducing new problems as well). In other words: we dug a hole for ourselves with technology, but the only way we can di…

Let's play with that notion for a bit: If technology is a tool, let's say akin to a spade. A spade gets you into a hole. Will more spades ever get you out of a hole? Sounds like you need a ladder instead.

I think your argument too simplified to be applicable to reality. What would the ladder be in your analogy? A dramatic reduction in population and a return to pre-industrial subsistence farming?

Re: Google DeepMind Founder Demis Hassabis: Three Truths about AI

#88

Post by TeMPOraL »

glitchc wrote: post #80
TeMPOraL wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Frankly, I can't really understand how come people believe what you just wrote. Yes, technology created many problems, but we can't solve them by doing less technology, without reintroducing problems we've already solved. We can either not solve them, or try to solve it with more progress (likely introducing new problems as well). In other words: we dug a hole for ourselves with technology, but the only way we can di…

Let's play with that notion for a bit: If technology is a tool, let's say akin to a spade. A spade gets you into a hole. Will more spades ever get you out of a hole? Sounds like you need a ladder instead.

Technology is all the tools. With a spade you got into a hole. With a ladder you'll climb out of it. Hopefully with treasure. Then that spade might help you fill the hole back in.

Particular technologies are highly intertwined - both directly and causally - so you can't really micromanage this. You have to push for technological develoment as a whole, and trim developments here, encourage there. For instance, we wouldn't be talking about renewable energy sources were it not for coal furnaces and internal combustion engines that allowed the world to progress to the point we even can exploit renewables. In this case not only we need the ladder because of the spade, but we also can have a ladder because of a spade.

Re: Google DeepMind Founder Demis Hassabis: Three Truths about AI

#89

Post by mistrial9 »

adwhit wrote: post #49

I always find it strange to hear people talk about climate change as if it is some sort of tricky challenge we need to solve, like improving education or curing cancer. It is a 'problem' of completely different magnitude. It is on track to end civilization as we know it within two generations. A rational society would think about nothing else. Our children will be astonished and mystified - and furious - to see all t…

quick elaboration on this ..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planetary_boundaries

Re: Google DeepMind Founder Demis Hassabis: Three Truths about AI

#90

Post by adwhit »

Notorious_BLT wrote: post #85
adwhit wrote: post #49

I always find it strange to hear people talk about climate change as if it is some sort of tricky challenge we need to solve, like improving education or curing cancer. It is a 'problem' of completely different magnitude. It is on track to end civilization as we know it within two generations. A rational society would think about nothing else. Our children will be astonished and mystified - and furious - to see all t…

So, as someone apparently aware of the problem on a level higher than most of humanity, and so confident that we should be thinking of nothing else, what are you doing daily to resolve the problem? Are all of your resources and time allocated to solving this? Obviously the answer is no, and probably for the same reasons as everyone else: people have other things going on in their lives.

I was actually just amused to see climate change used in a throwaway manner to justify some kind of AI whatever. The topic of climate change deserves to be talked about seriously or not at all.
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