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Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

cnbc.com

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Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#161

Post by MichaelApproved »

kamarg wrote: post #104
MichaelApproved wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$15/hour isn't much but it's fantastic for entry level pay. That's the minimum. Most people will be getting paid more. And, yes, of course money today is better than maybe money tomorrow. For example, higher pay today could allow someone replace a car that keeps breaking down on them. That reliability and cost savings of not having to pay for repairs can be worth more than stocks in the future. Edit typo

Honest question, do those raises amount to anything? Or is it akin to the $0.25/hr that many retail employees see that doesn't even provide them with the equivalent of an additional paycheck over the course of a year?

Another article mentions all employees will get a raise based on a curve related to the minimum increase. However, it's not clear just how that curve will look.

This raise is a good move, so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt that it won't be a superficial raise until the actual numbers come in.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#163

Post by mikeq101101 »

ajross wrote: post #141
swebs wrote: post #17

>In addition, the company also pledges its public policy team will lobby for an increase to the federal minimum wage from $7.25 — it doesn’t identify a specific wage that it’s targeting, but instead says, “We believe $7.25 is too low. We would look to Congress to decide the parameters of a new, higher federal minimum wage.” I'm going to take a wild guess and assume it will be $15/hour. That way they'll get to look pr…

> they'll get to look progressive for adopting this wage early, while mitigating their competitive disadvantage by forcing every other company to raise their wages too eventually. That's deeply cynical. In the process, they're actually paying real people more money. Which is sort of critically important if you care about this issue and not just taking pot shots at Amazon on HN.

He's right though. It's a great thing they voluntarily decided to pay their workers more. Forcing others to do so by the state's monopoly on force is immoral.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#164

Post by simias »

bhupy wrote: post #84
czep wrote: post #47

Opponents of the minimum wage argue that it reduces employment by creating an artificial floor on wages, that jobs are lost because employers can't afford to pay the minimum. But if you can't pay the minimum, then you didn't really have a job to offer in the first place! By extension of this logic, employers could argue that they are losing jobs because they can only afford to pay someone who will work 12 hours a day…

> If you can't pay a basic living wage, for fair hours, in safe conditions, with necessary medical benefits, then you don't have a job to offer. Why not let the employees decide if the job is worth taking? If there exists people willing to voluntarily take a job given its wage/conditions, you have a job to offer.

In the past I've been downvoted for replying to such a comment with something along the lines of "that makes sense if you're a libertarian". I think people assumed that I was baiting for something but I'm actually totally genuine when I say that: if you think a totally libertarian society is the way to go then things like minimum wage make little sense, just let individuals figure out what they want and don't want to do.

If you don't go full libertarian and you think that the state should provide some level of protection then things change because if people are not paid enough to live a decent life they'll end up falling into one of society's safety net (cost of law enforcement if people start stealing, cost of welfare if they require handouts to eat decently, cost to social security if they become sick due to poor living or working conditions etc...).

In such a situation you basically end with society subsidizing these jobs indirectly by cleaning the mess. That's why it makes more sense to simply force decent working conditions instead of encouraging a destructive race to the bottom.

Now in practice, regardless of our opinions, the USA is not a libertarian state, there are security nets, there is a certain level of socialized assistance (too much for some, not enough for others). In this situation it makes complete sense to have things like minimum wages and laws making it mandatory to wear your seat belt for instance.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#165

Post by Ericson2314 »

ajross wrote: post #141
swebs wrote: post #17

>In addition, the company also pledges its public policy team will lobby for an increase to the federal minimum wage from $7.25 — it doesn’t identify a specific wage that it’s targeting, but instead says, “We believe $7.25 is too low. We would look to Congress to decide the parameters of a new, higher federal minimum wage.” I'm going to take a wild guess and assume it will be $15/hour. That way they'll get to look pr…

> they'll get to look progressive for adopting this wage early, while mitigating their competitive disadvantage by forcing every other company to raise their wages too eventually. That's deeply cynical. In the process, they're actually paying real people more money. Which is sort of critically important if you care about this issue and not just taking pot shots at Amazon on HN.

If you critically care about this issue, the extent of which this is labor-driven vs PR-driven is crucial to the war in which $15/hour is just the first battle.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#166

Post by Steltek »

chrisseaton wrote: post #151
Steltek wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Political humor, especially satire, can sometimes cut through the fog of bullshit quite clearly.

I disagree I think it muddies the waters! A political comedian will have an agenda that they try to get across using satire, but they tell half-truths and exaggerate to make their jokes work. It's toxic, as some people don't understand the satire, or misunderstand which bits were exaggerated for comedic effect and which were based in fact.

That's a trait of humans and is not limited to comedians. In fact, the lens of comedy usually focuses on a political personality stating something completely foolish with complete sincerity in an attempt to score points.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#167

Post by jacquesm »

Shivetya wrote: post #87
swebs wrote: post #17

>In addition, the company also pledges its public policy team will lobby for an increase to the federal minimum wage from $7.25 — it doesn’t identify a specific wage that it’s targeting, but instead says, “We believe $7.25 is too low. We would look to Congress to decide the parameters of a new, higher federal minimum wage.” I'm going to take a wild guess and assume it will be $15/hour. That way they'll get to look pr…

$15 an hour will push a lot of people out of being employable. There is a greater tolerance for whom you will accept at current wage points. The other effect of a much higher starting wage is you will have people enter the market who did not think the wage was worth their time. The people who cannot be relied on to show up on schedule, quit and want to come back, have some issues in their credit or criminal backgroun…

> $15 an hour will push a lot of people out of being employable.

Or maybe it will just force employers to pay better wages to those they employ already.

$7.50 / hour is what they pay kids here to stock grocery chains.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#168

Post by driverdan »

Egidius wrote: post #64
chrisseaton wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe I've got no sense of humour, but I think that's unprofessional and something like bullying, rather than funny. Legislation should surely not target one individual by name like that?

If you pay your employees $7.25 you deserve to be made fun off at least. Jeff Bezos recently also said Amazon deserved being scrutinised. I'm not saying this is what triggered them, but sometimes you have to take a strong position in order to be listened to.

> If you pay your employees $7.25...

...then you're paying the wage your employees are willing to work for. Basic economics in action.

If you're making fun of this you need to take an econ 101 class.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#169

Post by rohitb91 »

zacharytelschow wrote: post #132
ashelmire wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think turning your employees into welfare-dependent wage-slaves is far worse than unprofessional or bullying, but I guess that's just me and most decent people. CEOs of large public companies have to take public heat, by name, quite often. It's a huge part of their job; otherwise they'd be COOs.

> turning your employees into welfare-dependent wage-slaves I wasn't aware staying with a particular employer was compulsory.

It's not compulsory, but it's where you find a job, whether it's because you're in a transition phase, a student, an immigrant, in hard times. And it's better than no job, and it sucks, and it doesn't have to be that the company reaches a 1 trillion market cap enriching stock holders and the owner makes 150+ billion dollars while the workers piss in bottles making minimum wage.

Re: Amazon raises minimum wage to $15 for all US employees

#170

Post by justtopost »

sumedh wrote: post #142
bhupy wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you can't pay a basic living wage, for fair hours, in safe conditions, with necessary medical benefits, then you don't have a job to offer. Why not let the employees decide if the job is worth taking? If there exists people willing to voluntarily take a job given its wage/conditions, you have a job to offer.

> If there exists people willing to voluntarily take a job given its wage/conditions, Lot of those people are illegal immigrants as well. They cant job hop.

They can if legal. I am not interested in supporting crime. You can argue that it is a crime worth comitting for many people, but its still not something we should encourage in employment law of all places.
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