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Brendan Eich Writes to the US Senate: We Need a GDPR for the United States

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Re: Brendan Eich Writes to the US Senate: We Need a GDPR for the United States

#71

Post by realusername »

scoom wrote: post #55
OskarS wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These are very real, very concrete negative effects of GDPR Your annoyance is misplaced. Don't be annoyed at GDPR: be annoyed at all the companies who have spent the last decades building an entire web-infrastructure with zero respect for user privacy. We built massive amounts of technology infrastructure that just assumed that privacy and tracking wasn't an issue. Why do these websites need all these cookies in th…

You talk as if the GDPR was a win for privacy. It wasn't. It was poorly drafted legislation by people who had no idea what they were doing.

https://www.zdnet.com/article/gdpr-cuts-tracking-cookies-in-... Tracking cookies have reduced a lot in the EU so I would call that a win for privacy.

Re: Brendan Eich Writes to the US Senate: We Need a GDPR for the United States

#72

Post by 13years »

kodablah wrote: post #37
OskarS wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These are very real, very concrete negative effects of GDPR Your annoyance is misplaced. Don't be annoyed at GDPR: be annoyed at all the companies who have spent the last decades building an entire web-infrastructure with zero respect for user privacy. We built massive amounts of technology infrastructure that just assumed that privacy and tracking wasn't an issue. Why do these websites need all these cookies in th…

This is how unintended consequences happen. Complaining how rational actors work around roadblocks has no practical effect. Who someone blames has no practical effect. The downside of looking at the intent of the law and assigning blame towards the market is that it encourages doubling down on these negative actions. Why not make popups illegal, they'll say. Why not make it illegal for you to optionally trade your da…

There is also the aspect that apparently there are plenty of people who are completely happy with exchanging data for free services.

For example:

"No Cash Needed At This Cafe. Students Pay The Tab With Their Personal Data" https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2018/09/29/643386327/no...

Re: Brendan Eich Writes to the US Senate: We Need a GDPR for the United States

#74

Post by onetimemanytime »

miracle2k wrote: post #25

The practical effect of GDPR seems to me that I have to click away about half a dozen consent popups every day. Sometimes a cookie warning in addition to that. If I use Private Browsing (to protect my privacy) I am punished with more popups. If I open a website within a browser shell on mobile that doesn't have my cookies (some kind of webview of an app), I am punished with more popups. Am I expected to look at every…

Same here. Not sure what goes behind the scenes but I have to click on "accept" to remove the pop-up window. So far worse for me, unless, there's something I don't know.

Re: Brendan Eich Writes to the US Senate: We Need a GDPR for the United States

#75

Post by [deleted] »

OskarS wrote: post #30
miracle2k wrote: post #25

The practical effect of GDPR seems to me that I have to click away about half a dozen consent popups every day. Sometimes a cookie warning in addition to that. If I use Private Browsing (to protect my privacy) I am punished with more popups. If I open a website within a browser shell on mobile that doesn't have my cookies (some kind of webview of an app), I am punished with more popups. Am I expected to look at every…

> These are very real, very concrete negative effects of GDPR Your annoyance is misplaced. Don't be annoyed at GDPR: be annoyed at all the companies who have spent the last decades building an entire web-infrastructure with zero respect for user privacy. We built massive amounts of technology infrastructure that just assumed that privacy and tracking wasn't an issue. Why do these websites need all these cookies in th…

[deleted]

Re: Brendan Eich Writes to the US Senate: We Need a GDPR for the United States

#76

Post by duxup »

miracle2k wrote: post #25

The practical effect of GDPR seems to me that I have to click away about half a dozen consent popups every day. Sometimes a cookie warning in addition to that. If I use Private Browsing (to protect my privacy) I am punished with more popups. If I open a website within a browser shell on mobile that doesn't have my cookies (some kind of webview of an app), I am punished with more popups. Am I expected to look at every…

Yeah I don't want to sit down with the digital form of someone's lawyers each time I visit a site, and if I have to I imagine I and others all just click away to get the dang content already.

The way GDPR works out it sort of expects us to care to follow this annoying process, and I don't think people do / want to and thus ultimately won't make good choices.

GDPR demands users engage in the process on the web in a very particular way. As far as that goes I suspect it will fail on that aspect.

Re: Brendan Eich Writes to the US Senate: We Need a GDPR for the United States

#78

Post by gepi79 »

scrollaway wrote: post #63
scoom wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You talk as if the GDPR was a win for privacy. It wasn't. It was poorly drafted legislation by people who had no idea what they were doing.

Your comment is being downvoted because you're just rambling like an old man grumpy about kids on his lawn. Not a single shred of evidence, or even an attempt at making an actual reasoned point. Every time there's comments like this I can't help but think I'd be extremely surprised if the people writing them knew any of the names of the people who worked on the law. I wonder what you even define as "having an idea wh…

And yet the poster is right for the reason mentioned by the first poster.

Most people click on the option that gives quick access to the content.

If it creates more than 2 seconds of distraction, I might even close the page.

There is no reason to trust the EU legislature regarding the internet after something like this:

https://juliareda.eu/2018/08/censorship-machines-gonna-censo...

Re: Brendan Eich Writes to the US Senate: We Need a GDPR for the United States

#79

Post by buboard »

shady-lady wrote: post #47
oblio wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The internet was doing fine for decades with minimal involvement from governments - why change things? Things change on their own. The internet used to be accessed by highly sophisticated and technical users. Now it's mainstream. And all mainstream things follow two basic rules: 1. Everything move at the speed of the slowest person. 2. The weakest members of the community need to be protected.

> The internet used to be accessed by highly sophisticated and technical users. Quaint but that's simply not true unless you're talking pre 90's. No point in kidding ourselves. The internet was accessed by people who accessed the internet. They popped a floppy/cd in a drive and followed instructions. They then opened a browser and typed a url. Nothing sophisticated about it. Nobody was creating electrical signals by…

> Nothing sophisticated about it.

Hmm no. You wouldn't even talk about it to avoid sounding like a weirdo.

Re: Brendan Eich Writes to the US Senate: We Need a GDPR for the United States

#80

Post by jacquesm »

kodablah wrote: post #58
jacquesm wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Complaining how rational actors work around roadblocks has no practical effect. I'm not sure I agree with the 'rational'. If you are so short-sighted as a company that your main course of action boils down to 'piss off the user' while doing everything you can to skirt the law then you deserve to suffer the longer term consequences. Rationality should operate on all time-frames simultaneously.

I very much wish incentives were aligned this way. However, as the ad tech sector has shown, consumer apathy is pervasive enough that you can push the envelope quite hard against them before the costs near the benefits. Couple that with the uncertainty of an ever-changing tech landscape (especially considering impending government interference), and optimizing for short term profits is "rational". That's "rational" a…

Hence the GDPR, which sort of makes this go full circle. These 'rational actors' are now trying with all their might to do an end-run around the law. It is interesting to see which companies 'get it' and which really don't get it. I suspect - and hope - that five years from now or so the ones that didn't get it will either have changed tack or will no longer be around.
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