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Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

money.cnn.com

71–80 of 128 posts

Re: Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

#71
post #38

Honestly surprised at how many people are posting comments about this. You know you'll end up on some list, right? Maybe you think it's ok to debate this kind of measure now, but the line will keep moving. In three years you may have people scouring your internet history for past wrongthink to deny you that promotion, or to get rid of you. In five years, machine learning algorithms may take your comments as input for…

This reads to me as "don't say things that leave you on the wrong side of history" - a solid recommendation for life in general.

You mean "on the wrong side of people who don't tolerate differences of opinion".

It's sad to see the left becoming so intolerant. In this very discussion we see people claiming that it's sexist to be against this law.

Personally, I think the law should treat all people equally, not single out groups for favorable treatment.

Re: Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

#72

Does this mean that all-female boards are also forbidden?

I'm curious how trans people are counted as well. Say you have 1 Cis female, 1 cis male, 1 trans male, 1 trans female. Can the fifth person be a cis male or trans male?

A trans woman is legally a woman and could be placed on the board to count.

A trans man is legally a man and would not count.

In California, transgender people are granted a lot of protections and rights, like the right to change their birth certificate gender, ID gender, etc. without surgery. It's one of the most progressive states on that issue.

Re: Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

#73
post #37
post #7

Why isn't the excuse of "representing the public" used to require certain members have a particular religion or race as well? What about income? Board members are about as far from representing society as you can get (and that's not the purpose of a board anyway) so I don't understand why this is being mandated. Seems like a strategy for cheap political points rather than any kind of well-reasoned reform.

A slippery slope argument seems really justified here as this legislation applies to boards that are quite small in size. If women need this special advantage, we only have to find a few other deserving minorities (race, religion and age seem like reasonable choices) before it is illegal to use merit as the first criteria for making up a corporate board. There is also a real concern with regulation like this is that…

> If women need this special advantage, we only have to find a few other deserving minorities (race, religion and age seem like reasonable choices) before it is illegal to use merit as the first criteria for making up a corporate board.

Adding other categories is actually worse than that, because it creates the need to specifically appoint an asian catholic female age 35-49. An asian catholic female in the 50-74 age group is no good because then the younger age group is underrepresented, a hispanic catholic female in the 35-49 age group is no good because then asians are underrepresented, etc. So the last board member not only can't be chosen on merit, they basically have to be ordered from a catalog of people whose function is to fit into whatever weird shaped box is formed by the composition of the existing board members. And if anyone leaves they either have to be replaced by someone of the same gender, race, religion and age or you have to discharge other existing board members and reconstitute the board.

Re: Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

#74
post #38

Honestly surprised at how many people are posting comments about this. You know you'll end up on some list, right? Maybe you think it's ok to debate this kind of measure now, but the line will keep moving. In three years you may have people scouring your internet history for past wrongthink to deny you that promotion, or to get rid of you. In five years, machine learning algorithms may take your comments as input for…

This reads to me as "don't say things that leave you on the wrong side of history" - a solid recommendation for life in general.

Predicting the future is your solid life advice? Would you recommend a crystal ball, a ouija board or a magic 8 ball?

Should I only concern myself with the long term history or do I have to worry about regressions mixed in? A lot of people thought they were on the right side of history with gay rights in Leninist Russia, it didn't turn out well.

Re: Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

#75
post #65
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seeing “quotas” in action already I can tell you they have the opposite effect than desired or imagined. Until now some people could imagine they didn’t get the job but she did because she’s a woman. Now they know and they’ll always hold this kind of law as proof. This does nothing to further women’s rights but certainly does a lot to discredit the ones that deseved to be there by casting a shadow over whether they’r…

Did school desegregation work?

I don’t know, was a law ever passed that mandated at least one black student in every school? Or just that thay had the right to compete for a spot?

So then why still allow all white boards? All Christian boards? All binary gender boards?

Unless maybe it’s just a shrewd political move.

Re: Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

#76
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just as a point of contention if I hypothetically identify as a trans women can I count as a women in the opinion of california

If you mean it, as in get a statement from a psychologist, and are executing a meaningful transition plan, your chances are good.

And what if you're gender fluid?

Re: Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

#77

This makes no sense. So a company that has a target market of men must have a woman on the board? So an all woman board will be legal? How female is female enough for them? Can someone just identify as a woman, or will there be a mandatory screening of what's between their legs (or what their DNA has)? I predict the outcome will just be companies will move headquarters to another state (already happening because of t…

Take a look at companies whose target customers are all women. Are you surprised to see a man on their board?

> Take a look at companies whose target customers are all women. Are you surprised to see a man on their board?

Are you surprised if they don't? Should they be required to?

Re: Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This reads to me as "don't say things that leave you on the wrong side of history" - a solid recommendation for life in general.

You mean "on the wrong side of people who don't tolerate differences of opinion". It's sad to see the left becoming so intolerant. In this very discussion we see people claiming that it's sexist to be against this law. Personally, I think the law should treat all people equally, not single out groups for favorable treatment.

In an idealized world it should. In reality, people aren't all equal. The circumstances of birth, genetics, society, societal memory and much more contribute to a world that left alone is inherently unfair. I'm for putting a finger on the scales a little bit to even out the inequalities. Not completely! But to look after the worst off, to right past wrongs (and we've made many mistakes getting here) and to push for a world where each individual is able to rise to the level of their competence and positive qualities by looking after their shortcomings. To create a meritocratic system in spite of the inherent inequalities.

So we're clear, I'm in favor or wealth inequality, and income inequality, but only coupled with social mobility. I'm in favor of having wealth as a reward for your contributions. And for a 90% estate tax to make sure each generation starts off without major advantages. I'm for socialized medicine so the circumstances of your birth or random chance don't stop you from achieving your potential. I'm for creating a world where nobody feels they can't achieve some level of success because of societal norms and if that means temporarily creating 'mandatory' role models, that's fine too.

If the world were inherently fair, wouldn't you already expect corporate boards to represent the rest of the society at large? And yet they don't so someone or somethings' finger must already be on the scales. Unless of course you're telling me only old white men are capable of being board members, that is. So in the interest of fairness, we should push back. A little. See what happens. Then act accordingly.

See how this would fit with my worldview?

I have friends who are incredibly right-wing and absolutely disagree with me, often, and I very much enjoy engaging them in conversation. I don't think they're wrong, I just disagree.

I don't think you're sexist for disagreeing with this law. I agree with it. I have my rationalizations and justifications, and I'm interested in hearing yours, and as always, in debating.

Re: Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

#79
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you mean it, as in get a statement from a psychologist, and are executing a meaningful transition plan, your chances are good.

And what if you're gender fluid?

Isn't that obvious you'll only be able to come to work when you identify as a women or the company gets fined hundreds of thousands of dollars

Re: Companies headquartered in California can no longer have all-male boards

#80

This is one hell of an overreach and will absolutely not improve the problem that it tries to solve. I am against identity politics on principle, but a much more amenable solution would have been something like offering tax incentives for companies who do. But aside from being way too heavy handed for a state, are they planning to do this for every “protected” class? Why only women?

> Why only women? Women are the largest "protected" class and the most visible, so a good start on getting "protected" classes on more equal footing.

Paradoxical how this so call "largest protected class" makes up the majority of the population, majority of college graduates, majority of purchasing decisions, etc - and yet it needs "protection" and laws to force equality of outcomes.
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