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SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

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Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#731

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was just commenting to my wife how remarkable I find it that my 2012 Macbook Pro 15 Retina is meeting all my needs as a software consultant. I used to think 3 years, maybe 4, was the useful lifespan of a high-end machine for daily professional use. In a few months it'll be 7 (seven) years old. It has 3 or 4 dead pixels, but everything else about it is working flawlessly. Maybe they don't make em like they used to,…

I'm posting this from a Macbook Pro I bought in November 2008. My family uses it daily. My daily work computer is a 2012 Macbook Air which I dropped from a standing height 4 years ago. It has one bent corner but still runs great.

Yep, I'm still using a 2008 MacBook Pro daily - I only replaced the HDD with an SSD and it runs great.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#732

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

I work for the guy, and I don't think anyone who has worked closely with him would believe that SpaceX or Tesla would be anywhere near what they are without him. He is an extraordinary leader who is deeply involved with all of the engineering decisions that happen at both companies. You'd be very surprised at how much impact he has on fairly low level decisions.

There is a phase in every company when that is a crucial thing to have, the earlier in a companies life cycle the more important it is. And then comes the point where such deep involvement of the CEO / founder is less important and even turns into a liability at one point.

At least for Tesla, I have the impression that this is, indeed, becoming a liability at the moment.

When the very top has a measurable impact on low level discisions it is a) eating up attention from the top level b) delaying even small decisions waiting for top level involvement and c) carrying the risk of bad decisions as the top level is, by definition, missing the detailed knowledge necessary for the majority of low level decisions. Not even to speak what that does to innovation and the flow of ideas and corporate culture in the long run.

Other famous examples of where this can end are VW and, at a smaller seriousness level, Bezo's deep involvement with the Fire phone.

Automotive mass production is, from a certain perspective, more complex than launching stuff to space. It is also a very well understood domain, first and foremost from established car manufacturers. So it would have made sense to also memorize some books covering that topic and than getting experts onboard. It doesn't help that an EV is less complex to build compared to traditional cars, so in that regard traditional manufacturers actually do have an advantage. I don't remember when he said it exactly (I think around the time Tesla bought this German manufacturing equipment supplier), but Musk stating that he also wants to revolutionize the way cars are manufactured. Why would you do that when your primary goal, one you are on very good track to accomplish, is revolutionizing mobility?

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#733

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

The company won't be fine because it'll be trading at $20 per share. (Yes, $20 is hyperbole, now read the rest) The real issue will be the 2019 bondholder covenants. Tesla won't have the cash to pay them, Tesla won't have the buying interest to absorb dilution, and Tesla will still need money. Basically with a lower and lower share price Tesla has fewer and fewer ways to service its debt and do further fundraising. T…

Seems to be the underlying reasoning of a lot of short sellers, doesn't it?

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#734

I think there's a bit of overexcitement going on in this thread; it doesn't look to me like Musk is going to jail on this one. This part is interesting: > The SEC had crafted a settlement with Musk that it was preparing to file Thursday morning, the Wall Street Journal reported, citing unidentified people familiar with the matter. Musk’s lawyers called SEC lawyers to say they were no longer interested in proceeding w…

Even if you settle with the SEC you can still go to jail because it is not the SEC that decides over this but the DOJ. Look at what happened to Elizabeth Holmes, she reached a settlement with the SEC but is still facing jail time because of the DOJ.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#735

Glad it's only a CEO, imagine what a president could do with Twitter!

Someone has to explain that to me. Is the POTUS all powerful and can pretty much say anything?

No, but the republican majority in congress refuses to hold him accountable, and possibly voters too. Time will tell.

It is rather absurd that a CEO is seemingly held to higher standards then the president.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#736

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't believe so. I have been a Tesla owner and investor for a long time now. I know where Elon comes from, what missions and goals he has stated for years now, and what he is trying to accomplish. I promise you, Elon legitimately thought there would be an opportunity to go private again. He's said he wanted to do so in the past, and even has said they never wanted to go public, but were left with no choice. I don'…

Au contraire - I think what's more fascinating about this is Musk's personal branding, which apologists like you have bought into. Just hear me out. I mean, insiders and the SEC clearly know he didn't have an offer to go private on the table when he announced. With Musk's pattern of behavior on twitter recently (pedophile name-calling, weed gifs, etc.) it's much more likely that he was reacting to the short sellers t…

>clearly know

This is clearly your opinion..

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#737

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. Which is amusing in the case of Musk. As I've said over and over, his approach is to find an industry where most or all of the hard, expensive fundamental R&D has already been done (and paid for) by someone else, and then start a company to incrementally improve it and promise vast cost reductions from economies of scale. That's what SpaceX is. That's what Tesla is. The…

What is baffling to me is the length that some HN commenters will go to to tear down people like Elon and Steve Jobs. Maybe you don't like him, maybe you don't like how much attention and praise he gets. But to be so dismissive of what those companies have accomplished with him at the helm, to me is just unwarranted bitter negativity. In your mind, what companies are doing staggering heart-breaking Copernican-revolut…

the length that some HN commenters will go to to tear down people like Elon

I suppose if you read literally anything other than absolutely fawning worship of Elon Musk as history's most titanic genius as a "tear down", I could see that.

But... it is absolutely true that his business model is incremental improvements + economies of scale. Tesla and SpaceX aren't in the business of inventing fundamentally new things. They're in the business of making improvements to already-invented things, and mass-producing them to try to bring costs down. This is only a troubling thing to read if you're deeply invested in his cult of personality.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#738

This comment I made a few weeks ago is coming alot closer to the truth than I would have expected. I hope for Space X and Tesla's sake that the reports of a directory and Executive ban don't come true. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18016250#18016292 SpaceX is doing well, Tesla has pulled itself back from the brink and may actually become a profitable car company. All Elon had to do was keep his head down and n…

Why do you say for SpaceX's sake? Would it not be great news for SpaceX that their CEO would be forced out of the other companies he's running, and thus almost has to focus most of his time on SpaceX?

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#739
post #704

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This kind of thinking makes sense (Musk is smart, he must make decisions rationally) but it is sort of empirically denied. If Musk was so smart he wouldn't have called a random guy a pedo or violated securities law in public. After all, he has more information/advice available to him on securities law than you or I do.

Don't you find something off that you need to reference things that have yet to be resolved to find instances of him acting unjustifiably irrational? Neither statement he made has yet been shown to not be a statement of fact. If he was simply making up things in either case then he will pay, quite literally. If he wasn't then instead this will end up just being yet another 'sky is falling' moment that people will qui…

I find that the easiest explanation is the God complex that has brought down many men before Musk and will bring down many more after him.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#740

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

The company won't be fine because it'll be trading at $20 per share. (Yes, $20 is hyperbole, now read the rest) The real issue will be the 2019 bondholder covenants. Tesla won't have the cash to pay them, Tesla won't have the buying interest to absorb dilution, and Tesla will still need money. Basically with a lower and lower share price Tesla has fewer and fewer ways to service its debt and do further fundraising. T…

Then the bondowners end up restructuring and owning a valuable company.
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