SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal • Hacker News Board

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#651

Post by carte_blanche » Fri, Sep 28, 2018, 4:56 AM UTC

eksemplar wrote: post #633

stcredzero wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are Apple products different now that Jobs are gone? Yes. Jobs as local despot acted as a curb to bad decisions. Jobs had a vision which acted as a countervailing force to keep Apple from being completely sucked into being a money grubbing luxury goods company. the core people that make and design all their overpriced, planned obsolescence devices are still there, often uncredited, while everyone else likes to focus…

I think Apple products are actually better, maybe not so much because of Apple but because their competitors suck. Android is terrible, I mean, it’s looking more and more like iOS, but it’s still not iOS and it has no privacy if you want to use the official play store (which you want, because all the apps that actually make your phone smart, only live there). Android phones still die after a few years, my iPhone 5s i…

OSM is better than GMaps?

I hate having to go to Google for everything as much as the next guy, but I just can't bring myself to use OSM over Google Maps. GMpas are just.. better in every case.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#652

Post by cheeze » Fri, Sep 28, 2018, 4:57 AM UTC

bdcravens wrote: post #616

usaphp wrote: post #538

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the guy literally built a fucking reusable rocket company, most popular payment service, an electric car company that now all of the huge car monopolies are trying to mimic and replicate and still can’t catch, and he did all of that during 20 years, 99.9% of people sit on a couch for 20 years without doing anything. But experts on hacker news still think he is a terrible ceo. I am pretty sure most of those experts…

I think HN's ire isn't based on him being a "terrible CEO"; it's anger toward the hubris of what is seen as someone who thinks the rules don't apply to them.

Everything up this point has shown that they don't though

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#653

Post by eksemplar » Fri, Sep 28, 2018, 4:59 AM UTC

carte_blanche wrote: post #651

eksemplar wrote: post #633

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Apple products are actually better, maybe not so much because of Apple but because their competitors suck. Android is terrible, I mean, it’s looking more and more like iOS, but it’s still not iOS and it has no privacy if you want to use the official play store (which you want, because all the apps that actually make your phone smart, only live there). Android phones still die after a few years, my iPhone 5s i…

OSM is better than GMaps? I hate having to go to Google for everything as much as the next guy, but I just can't bring myself to use OSM over Google Maps. GMpas are just.. better in every case.

I’m Danish, OSM is updated a lot faster than gmaps. Obviously google is better at routing and traffic, but routing doesn’t work if a road is closed for construction and google doesn’t know.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#654

Post by appleiigs » Fri, Sep 28, 2018, 5:00 AM UTC

rl3 wrote: post #252

SkyMarshal wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think Apple products are any different without Jobs, the problem is they’re nothing new either. With Jobs you knew he loved and lived technology and was always looking for cool new things to do with it. Most of his product launches did just that and brought some excitement about possibilities. Current Apple products are meticulously, exactingly designed and built, but they’re losing the excitement and expecta…

> Current Apple products are meticulously, exactingly designed and built, ... I disagree. Look at the MBP keyboard issues, or the declining quality of OS X. Under Jobs that shit wouldn't fly. Other roles aside, one of Jobs' most important functions was that of acting as a sanity check to ensure that the constiuent parts of any given product came together as a cohesive whole.

For me the best examples of shit that wouldn't fly is the the iphone's protruding camera and the notch.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#655

Post by dingaling » Fri, Sep 28, 2018, 5:00 AM UTC

ramblerman wrote: post #622

djsumdog wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

Of course he has an amazing team of engineers. But if Mush hadn't been born, they would have never come together to create Tesla.

> they would have never come together to create Tesla.

They already did, since Tesla predates Mr Musk's involvement

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#656

Post by colordrops » Fri, Sep 28, 2018, 5:03 AM UTC

SteveNuts wrote: post #638

colordrops wrote: post #631

Something's not right in the US when one of the world's top innovators and fighters for renewable energy is toppled by a tired tweet, and the unaccomplished sexual molester of a leader of the US says many far worst things on nearly a daily basis for years and gets away with it.

You have to be extremely careful with your public statements when you run a publicly traded company. Full stop.

I get that, hence my statement. I don't think it should be the case.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#657

Post by hef19898 » Fri, Sep 28, 2018, 5:06 AM UTC

api wrote: post #589

djsumdog wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

If Musk never happened rockets would still be expendable, the US would still lack a Shuttle replacement, and EVs would be rare or nonexistent. We would still be talking about how personal mobility is doomed when oil is depleted, if not all of modern civilization. Prove me wrong. Who else was doing this stuff before SpaceX and Tesla? On space launch you had nothing serious except the SLS which is 70s tech. On EVs you…

A agree wizh you on the Tesla part, there Musk really forced very positive development. One could argue of course if that development wouldn't have taken place as well without Tesla. But even then it is clear that Musk / Tesla moved things along a lot faster.

SpaceX is an incredible achievement. The reusable rockets are a point I really need to dig deeper into, especially the financial aspects of it. Because there a pretty convincing argument is that peivate SpaceX launches are subsidized by government launches. I really have to go hunting for some numbers there more I think about it. And even then, building competitive rockets, not just one, in a private endevour is incredible.

I'm just wondering if Musk is not getting to much credit and hype. Not that he would need it, even the smallest common ground regarding Musk's achievements is more than enough for a lifetime. Unless he throwing all of it away over some paranoid obsession about short sellers and a loose Twitter finger...

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#658

Post by sokoloff » Fri, Sep 28, 2018, 5:07 AM UTC

erikb wrote: post #646

chollida1 wrote: post #6

This comment I made a few weeks ago is coming alot closer to the truth than I would have expected. I hope for Space X and Tesla's sake that the reports of a directory and Executive ban don't come true. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18016250#18016292 SpaceX is doing well, Tesla has pulled itself back from the brink and may actually become a profitable car company. All Elon had to do was keep his head down and n…

> So when Elon tweeted, a whole whack of shorts got stopped out What means stopped out? The bank forcing the lender to give the stock back right at this point?

Many investors (long or short) place what are called stop orders to protect their positions from steep losses.

For a long investor, you might buy a stock at $100, watch it go up to $150 and enter a sell-stop order at $130. That stop order has no effect so long as the price stays above $130. When/if the stock drops to $130, the order becomes a market order to sell out, protecting from further losses.

For a short seller, they might place a buy-stop order (at a price higher than the current price) to protect from disastrous runaway price to the high side. Those stops could have been triggered by the run-up after Musk's tweet.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#659

Post by dingaling » Fri, Sep 28, 2018, 5:07 AM UTC

api wrote: post #589

djsumdog wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

If Musk never happened rockets would still be expendable, the US would still lack a Shuttle replacement, and EVs would be rare or nonexistent. We would still be talking about how personal mobility is doomed when oil is depleted, if not all of modern civilization. Prove me wrong. Who else was doing this stuff before SpaceX and Tesla? On space launch you had nothing serious except the SLS which is 70s tech. On EVs you…

> but nothing pushing to break into any mass market.

Nissan Leaf 2010

Tesla Model S 2012

Renault Zoe 2013

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#660

Post by siberianbear » Fri, Sep 28, 2018, 5:09 AM UTC

erikb wrote: post #646

chollida1 wrote: post #6

This comment I made a few weeks ago is coming alot closer to the truth than I would have expected. I hope for Space X and Tesla's sake that the reports of a directory and Executive ban don't come true. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18016250#18016292 SpaceX is doing well, Tesla has pulled itself back from the brink and may actually become a profitable car company. All Elon had to do was keep his head down and n…

> So when Elon tweeted, a whole whack of shorts got stopped out What means stopped out? The bank forcing the lender to give the stock back right at this point?

"Shorting" a stock means selling it without owning it, essentially owning negative stock. You're betting that it will go down, and then when it does go down, you close your position by buying the stock (to get back to zero shares).

The risk in doing this is unlimited. If you short a stock at $100, and then it goes to $500, you've lost $400.

Your broker doesn't want to take liability for your loss if you're not able to cover it. So your broker will forcibly close your position for you.

Even if your broker doesn't close your position, you might do it yourself to stop losing money.

When a lot of people do this all at once, it's called a "short squeeze" as everyone who was short buys shares to close their short positions. It can make the price go up.

I don't follow Tesla's stock price, but Musk getting on Twitter saying something that could make the stock price go up could (and perhaps did) cause a short squeeze.