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SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

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Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#361
post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think Apple products are any different without Jobs, the problem is they’re nothing new either. With Jobs you knew he loved and lived technology and was always looking for cool new things to do with it. Most of his product launches did just that and brought some excitement about possibilities. Current Apple products are meticulously, exactingly designed and built, but they’re losing the excitement and expecta…

> Current Apple products are meticulously, exactingly designed and built, ... I disagree. Look at the MBP keyboard issues, or the declining quality of OS X. Under Jobs that shit wouldn't fly. Other roles aside, one of Jobs' most important functions was that of acting as a sanity check to ensure that the constiuent parts of any given product came together as a cohesive whole.

Again with the revisionist history.

Did you ever use the first 3 versions of OSX ? Because I did. And the quality was pretty unacceptable compared to OS9 or Windows. On the hardware side how long did Apple stick with the coffee puck mouse. Or how about the iPhone 1 never even having 3G or MMS or how about all of the issues with the GPU.

But yet Steve Jobs still shipped it all. Why ? Because his slogan was always "real artists ship".

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Couldn't he assign the janitor to be the official 'CEO', but then give himself title of 'Visionary' and still make all the decisions?

Part of being a visionary CEO is making choices that other people don't like, and sticking with them. As a janitor, you can suggest all you want, but unless you're on the Board, you can't force things through (unless you rely on backchannel bribery or coercion or other unsavory means).

Musk is also on the board.

But the SEC is also seeking to remove him from the board of any public company. So he'd lose his chair and the CEO position in this single case.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#363
The book The PayPal Wars: Battles with eBay, the Media, the Mafia, and the Rest of Planet Earth, details Musk's time at Paypal and pretty much describes him as an eventual hindrance rather than a help. He was eventually ousted from the company. Peter Thiel was the one that was able to nurse the company to success.

He was vital to get the company started but eventually, he was difficult to work with. Looks to me that history repeats itself. He's a great visionary but that does not translate to a great CEO.

He needs to get a new CEO at Tesla and focus on another company where I'm sure he'll make a great impact. He truly has great vision but the everyday minutia of running a company probably irritates and bores him.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#365

He definitely lost it. And it's going to cost him. This is an open and shut case against Musk. He definitely sent out that tweet. Yes, maybe just not enough sleep and too many drugs. Not a good excuse. Tesla might do better with a new CEO. They're past the vision stage. Tesla's problems today are all those of running a big auto plant. Musk might do better focusing on Space-X.

Elon Musk has always had a disdain for the responsibility of running a public company, it seems perfectly reasonable that he tweet, in exasperation, that he wishes to make the company private. Why do so many people in this thread want the only guy making (rockets && green cars && batteries && solar && ...) to fail so badly? The guy smokes weed once on camera, now he's a witch and needs to be hunted down? We care about the wrong things.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#366
post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure though. SpaceX is a federal contractor. And to be at the helm of a company with federal access, you might need a clean record. When Musk was smoking pot on radio, the AirForce had to look into it to see if there was any actions they needed to take.

Why didn't they? He was committing a federal crime.

You don't want to have to go hat in hand to the Russians for RD-180 engines to launch your national security payloads (which the Russians specifically won't sell their engines to US integrators for [1] [2]), or waste $100 million more on an unnecessary Delta launch (vs Atlas). Better to ignore a minor infraction.

[1] https://www.google.com/search?q=russian+engines+national+sec...

[2] https://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/americas-national...

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Volt was also not GM’s first EV. Both the Roadster and GM’s EV 1 were niche products. You can call the Leaf a golf cart, but it’s sold more vehicles than the Model S. Yes the Model S has more performance, but it’s also a vastly more expensive car. As to other manufacturers, they were “building up electric manufacturing capability” before Tesla. Toyota was selling thr first RAV 4 EV before Tesla was even founded.…

Are you aware that the RAV 4 EV used Tesla batteries? Regarding the Roadster being "niche", it still looked like a normal car at least, unlike the EV 1, and any other electric car at the time. Furthermore, they had a roadmap to more affordable cars that still fit the moniker "normal". Other car companies were just running their EV projects as experiments, or as a way to appease California legislators to meet quotas,…

The first RAV 4 EV came out in 1997. Tesla was founded in 2003.

> No one was trying to make a non-toy full electric car until Tesla.

The Roadster was a toy, costing over $100,000 and selling approximately 2,500 vehicles, in the same ballpark as the EV1. The idea that it spurred GM and Nissan to build completely different EVs for the opposite end of the market is delusional. The timing also doesn’t work. It took Tesla several years to bring the Roadster to the prototype stage. Counting back a similar length of time from when the Volt was unveiled as a concept car, that means GM would’ve been working on it since 2004 or so, years before the Roadster came out.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#368

This comment I made a few weeks ago is coming alot closer to the truth than I would have expected. I hope for Space X and Tesla's sake that the reports of a directory and Executive ban don't come true. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18016250#18016292 SpaceX is doing well, Tesla has pulled itself back from the brink and may actually become a profitable car company. All Elon had to do was keep his head down and n…

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

> but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the thousands of people in his organizations that actually do the work.

He says it all-the-time. And sometimes without any prompt.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#369
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without short sellers or another market mechanism to call bullshit on over-inflated and over-hyped investments, capital will be badly allocated. You're imagining some future where because of shorts we don't put enough money into TSLA and never have electric cars. That's not how this works. With shorts (if the short sellers are right) TSLA is full of it, and capital is much better allocated at BMW, Toyota, or some oth…

> Without short sellers or another market mechanism to call bullshit on over-inflated and over-hyped investments, capital will be badly allocated. Capital allocates to what is best for the markets, not what is best for the world. I can't breath shareholder returns. We can't wait for BMW and Toyota to cannibalize their internal combustion product lines with EVs because it's not financially convenient for them (runaway…

Short-sellers didn't cause Elon Musk to tweet fraudulently, putting himself and his company into legal jeopardy with the SEC.

Frankly, Q3 2018 was shaping up to be a big moment where M3 cars were mass produced and selling well. If Mr. Musk just shut up for the past 6 months and never tweeted anything, then Tesla would be in a far stronger position.

Today: Musk has to deal with the pedophile slander lawsuit, the SEC investigation, and now the DoJ investigation. The shorts did NONE of this, it was all Mr. Musk's mistake. If Mr. Musk sat tight, released the (what seem to be) good Q3 2018 numbers, then the shorts would have been busted naturally.

That's how you "beat the shorts". Have a strong quarter, have a strong year, and push the stock price up. Short sellers lose money every time the stock rises.

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And I'm sure people out there will complain about the 2-billion convertible loan due 2019, and how short-sellers are destroying the $360 price point.

Guess what? The CEO's job is to secure funding. It was Mr. Musk who signed Tesla to that deal. If you think the loan was idiotic, then it was Mr. Musk's fault for signing the loan back in 2014.

That's Musk's decision however. He's had 5 years to make a profit on a 5-year loan with 0.25% coupon (!!!) and that's his own darn fault for not keeping track of it and turning a profit in time.

(Frankly: 0.25% loan for 5-years are stupendous terms. I do think it was good way to raise money)

Details on the loan due March 2019: http://finra-markets.morningstar.com/BondCenter/BondDetail.j...

The terms of this loan are: $360 call option or cash back on March 2019. Which means bondholders can buy the stock at $360 (no matter what price TSLA is at), OR can demand cash back instead. Given the current price of TSLA, it seems like the bondholders will ask for Cash.

But Musk clearly though, way back in 2014 when he signed this deal, that he would raise the stock price to $360 to avoid paying back the loan. OR he was fine with a 0.25% coupon (!!) on a 5-year rate. Anyone who follows finances knows that this bond was an incredible deal to the advantage of Tesla, and no one should be touting this loan as a disadvantage.

Re: SEC Sues Musk and Seeks Ban for His Tweets on Go-Private Deal

#370

This comment I made a few weeks ago is coming alot closer to the truth than I would have expected. I hope for Space X and Tesla's sake that the reports of a directory and Executive ban don't come true. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18016250#18016292 SpaceX is doing well, Tesla has pulled itself back from the brink and may actually become a profitable car company. All Elon had to do was keep his head down and n…

I'd hope the company itself would be fine. I really hate this idea of the grand visionary. A good friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer despises Musk. I listened to a bit of his Joe Regan interview and when Regan asked him how he has the time to do all of the things he does, there are smoke jokes about him being an alien, but not once did he say, "Well I have an amazing team of engineers" and credit all the tho…

Well, to quote Mueller:

>It’s really— it’s quite a trip, working for Elon. It’s different every day [laughter] because it all depends on what mood he’s in [laughter] — they think he’s joking> You know, he’s been in a great mood lately; we’ve been very successful, and Tesla’s been doing quite well. So it’s been good recently. Um, he still; he’s still extremely demanding. One thing I tell people often is that— I’ve seen this happen quite a few times in the fifteen years I’ve worked for him. We’ll have, you know, a group of people sitting in a room, making a key decision. And everybody in that room will say, you know, basically, “We need to turn left,” and Elon will say “No, we’re gonna turn right.” You know, to put it in a metaphor. And that’s how he thinks. He’s like, “You guys are taking the easy way out; we need to take the hard way.”

>And, uh, I’ve seen that hurt us before, I’ve seen that fail, but I’ve also seen— where nobody thought it would work— it was the right decision. It was the harder way to do it, but in the end, it was the right thing. One of the things that we did with the Merlin 1D was; he kept complaining— I talked earlier about how expensive the engine was. [inaudible] [I said,] “[the] only way is to get rid of all these valves. Because that’s what’s really driving the complexity and cost.” And how can you do that? And I said, “Well, on smaller engines, we’d go face-shutoff, but nobody’s done it on a really large engine. It’ll be really difficult.” And he said, “We need to do face-shutoff. Explain how that works?” So I drew it up, did some, you know, sketches, and said “here’s what we’d do,” and he said “That’s what we need to do.” And I advised him against it; I said it’s going to be too hard to do, and it’s not going to save that much. But he made the decision that we were going to do face-shutoff.

>So we went and developed that engine; and it was hard. We blew up a lot of hardware. And we tried probably tried a hundred different combinations to make it work; but we made it work. I still have the original sketch I did; I think it was— what was it, Christmas 2011, when I did that sketch? And it’s changed quite a bit from that original sketch, but it was pretty scary for me, knowing how that hardware worked, but by going face-shutoff, we got rid of the main valves, we got rid of the sequencing computer; basically, you spin the pumps and pressure comes up, the pressure opens the main injector, lets the oxygen go first, and then the fuel comes in. So all you gotta time is the ignitor fluid. So if you have the ignitor fluid going, it’ll light, and it’s not going to hard start. That got rid of the problem we had where you have two valves; the oxygen valve and the fuel valve. The oxygen valve is very cold and very stiff; it doesn’t want to move. And it’s the one you want open first. If you relieve the fuel, it’s what’s called a hard start. In fact, we have an old saying that says, “[inaudible][When you start a rocket engine, a thousand things could happen, and only one of those is good]“, and by having sequencing correctly, you can get rid of about 900 of those bad things, we made these engine very reliable, got rid of a lot of mass, and got rid of a lot of costs. And it was the right thing to do.

>And now we have the lowest-cost, most reliable engines in the world. And it was basically because of that decision, to go to do that. So that’s one of the examples of Elon just really pushing— he always says we need to push to the limits of physics.

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