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WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

forbes.com

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Re: WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

#311

Post by charmides »

jonas21 wrote: post #279
madrox wrote: post #163

I'm sure Acton and Koum told themselves they were also keeping the power to be in control. I'm sure they went into it thinking they could avoid this end. The brain is a powerful rationalizer when it sees generational wealth within reach. The indignant tone of the comments here make me laugh. There are very few things I can imagine readers of HN not doing for a billion dollars. People may say otherwise, but until they…

> The indignant tone of the comments here make me laugh. Yeah, the level of indignation and self-righteousness in the comments on HN (and not just in this thread) seems to have gotten worse lately. Maybe time for me to take a break from HN for a bit...

I think it is good that this community praises founders who do the right thing and condemns those who do the wrong thing, even though most of us will never play for such high stakes.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

#312

Post by scarface74 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #283
scarface74 wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ascribing ethics or lack of ethics to a business is like ascribing the same traits to a non sentient being. Even if your manager is ethical and “cares” about the well being of his employees, his manager may not. Even if his manager does the board, the investors/shareholders, etc. probably don’t. The whole purpose of a corporation is that a corporation survives without regards of any one person getting hit by a bus. I…

> Ascribing ethics or lack of ethics to a business is like ascribing the same traits to a non sentient being This is defeatist. Corporations can be sued in courts, just like people. Their obligations are binding, just like peoples'. There is a little more complexity to signing a deal with a corporation than a natural person because there are multiple sapient interests involved, but that's what lawyers are for. Protec…

This is defeatist. Corporations can be sued in courts, just like people. Their obligations are binding, just like peoples'. There is a little more complexity to signing a deal with a corporation than a natural person because there are multiple sapient interests involved, but that's what lawyers are for.

I never said that companies go around breaking legally binding contracts or there is no recourse if they do. I said you shouldn’t trust a handshake deal when doing any business that amounts to real money. Get it in writing.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

#313

Post by chadash »

sushisource wrote: post #282
deleted_account wrote: post #139

I feel like I'm coming across more of these "exit, then atone" profiles and none of them seem to have any teeth. They read like self-help articles for the ultra-rich: "Broken moral compass keeping you up at night? Try driving a Honda Odyssey." I get it; you took the money. I'd sure as hell take the money. One anecdote about sniping at Sheryl Sandberg is washed away by this milquetoast sentiment: “It was like, okay, w…

I also fail to see how driving a minivan makes you a better person. I don't understand why we fetishize the rich who live like they aren't. I get not overconsuming, but if you're gonna buy a car might as well make it a nice one - the impact is basically the same.

The environmental impact, sure, but there's also a "keeping up with the Joneses" factor. If people don't flaunt their status, other people won't feel as pressured to either.

I once heard a very wealthy guy complain that "everyone these days wears a Rolex", so he needs to buy something fancier. Well, once every super wealthy person goes out and buys something fancier, then the less wealthy people will want that and the effect trickles down. The fact is that conspicuous consumption is a problem for our society in that it leads people to buy things that they can't afford. By driving a minivan, Brian Acton isn't contributing to that problem as much and I commend him for it.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

#314

Post by robszumski »

jiveturkey wrote: post #67
mattnewport wrote: post #7

This article seems a little unfair to the WhatsApp founders when it suggests they should have known that any assurances Facebook made to them as part of the acquisition were obviously lies. Sure in 2018 it might be obvious to most of us that nothing Facebook says or promises can be trusted but I don't think that was necessarily as obvious when the acquisition happened and they can be forgiven for thinking they weren'…

are you serious? these guys aren’t dummies. there was an anti-monetization clause in the contract. you don’t put that there out of an over abundance of caution. they knew exactly FB’s intentions. they maybe didn’t expect it to come home to roost so quickly, but they should have. again, these are smart guys. they just couldn’t get past the billions, plain and simple.

Negotiating that clause in there in the first place is extremely customer/user friendly and I can't believe they were able to do it. I have never heard of this before, especially for such a high profile acquisition...to a known ad company.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

#315

Post by roywiggins »

chadash wrote: post #313
sushisource wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also fail to see how driving a minivan makes you a better person. I don't understand why we fetishize the rich who live like they aren't. I get not overconsuming, but if you're gonna buy a car might as well make it a nice one - the impact is basically the same.

The environmental impact, sure, but there's also a "keeping up with the Joneses" factor. If people don't flaunt their status, other people won't feel as pressured to either. I once heard a very wealthy guy complain that "everyone these days wears a Rolex", so he needs to buy something fancier. Well, once every super wealthy person goes out and buys something fancier, then the less wealthy people will want that and th…

It's a Red Queen effect, I guess.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

#316

Post by madrox »

jonas21 wrote: post #279
madrox wrote: post #163

I'm sure Acton and Koum told themselves they were also keeping the power to be in control. I'm sure they went into it thinking they could avoid this end. The brain is a powerful rationalizer when it sees generational wealth within reach. The indignant tone of the comments here make me laugh. There are very few things I can imagine readers of HN not doing for a billion dollars. People may say otherwise, but until they…

> The indignant tone of the comments here make me laugh. Yeah, the level of indignation and self-righteousness in the comments on HN (and not just in this thread) seems to have gotten worse lately. Maybe time for me to take a break from HN for a bit...

I've been seeing the same thing...not just in HN, but across tech.

My theory is there's a lot of resentment of the successful. We're seeing a new generation of engineers enter the workforce that never got to participate in the previous booms, and it's not as easy to make it big as it used to be.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

#317

Post by XJOKOLAT »

mabbo wrote: post #304
mort96 wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think demonizing the guys behind WhatsApp is entirely warranted. They built up a large userbase around promises of privacy and encryption, and then promptly sold those users to fucking Facebook. Whether they were just gullible and didn't do their due diligence, or if they were malignant, doesn't really make a big difference.

For a few billion dollars, it's pretty easy to see myself doing the same thing. We're entering a world of a widening disparity between rich and poor. A billion dollars puts you, your children, and their children in the very wealthy side of that line for their entire lives. That's hard to say no to.

Fucken sell out.

Is what I would have said.

Are these the scum you breed?

Way to go YC.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

#318

Post by bambax »

dasil003 wrote: post #38
mattnewport wrote: post #7

This article seems a little unfair to the WhatsApp founders when it suggests they should have known that any assurances Facebook made to them as part of the acquisition were obviously lies. Sure in 2018 it might be obvious to most of us that nothing Facebook says or promises can be trusted but I don't think that was necessarily as obvious when the acquisition happened and they can be forgiven for thinking they weren'…

Nah, 2014 makes no material difference. It's not the recent scandals that have somehow revealed Facebook to be the spiritual successor to Microsoft's "embrace and extend" strategy; this has been obvious for at least a decade. Maybe the public didn't realize it yet, but anyone in tech, especially a successful founding team would have been well aware. That said, I'm not going to demonize these guys. Brian Acton clearly…

I think what happened in their head is, they knew Facebook was kind of lying but they thought would be strong enough to prevent the worst from happening. They had built a very successful app in very little time with very little ressources; they just felt they were invincible.

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

#319

Post by EthanHeilman »

toast0 wrote: post #113
buboard wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

so offline messaging was such a difficult thing to solve without selling? I doubt it. Skype hasn't improved much, not only because MS is not doing its best, but also ISPs typically throttle that.

Centralization was more or less required to do offline messaging. Not so much the selling bit (but note that Skype had already been sold twice before Microsoft bought it in 2011). I agree Microsoft hasn't done a good job with it, though.

You could cache encrypted messages on a P2P network until the offline party comes online. There is no money in that, but from a technical PoV it is very doable.

Systems like the lightning network on Bitcoin or Raiden on Ethereum are working on something similar for outsourced channel monitoring (aka watchtowers).

Re: WhatsApp Cofounder Brian Acton on Why He Left $850M Behind

#320

Post by breck »

josephjrobison wrote: post #307
mabbo wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a few billion dollars, it's pretty easy to see myself doing the same thing. We're entering a world of a widening disparity between rich and poor. A billion dollars puts you, your children, and their children in the very wealthy side of that line for their entire lives. That's hard to say no to.

True on the divide but at the same time the world has never been as rich, prosperous, or secure. https://www.gatesnotes.com/Development/Goalkeepers?WT.mc_id=... Obviously a very ironic source but the others were more political.

Also, the extreme divide between rich and poor has always existed. I’ve never seen a strong data-supported case that it’s any worse today than 100 or 1000 years ago.
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