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Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades

latimes.com

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Re: Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades

#61

Post by bsder »

nradov wrote: post #44
bsder wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is relatively straightforward to solve. You take the existing CA gas tax and have it increase a couple of pennies every single month indefinitely. Gasoline in California is still about 1/2 the price in Europe. By making the tax small and gradual, everybody can PLAN around the fact that gas is going up instead of the dislocation from when gasoline prices whipsaw. The problem is that we have zero political will to…

There's only a loose correlation between gasoline consumption and smog emissions. Newer passenger vehicles are very clean (not counting CO₂ emissions which are a separate issue). The smog problem is caused by diesel engines, and older gasoline engines. Those need to be banned, or bought back and crushed (like with the "Cash for Clunkers" program several years ago).

> There's only a loose correlation between gasoline consumption and smog emissions.

For only automobiles, possibly.

But a slow and consistent increase in petroleum price incentivizes the trucking industry as well.

And, as the article points out, the trucking industry is responsible for huge pollution hotspots near the ports.

Re: Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades

#62

Post by mrhappyunhappy »

refurb wrote: post #8

Los Angeles is unfortunate that due to the surrounding geography, thermal inversions are common where air close to the surface is trapped and doesn't circulate. That amplifies the air quality problems compared to say SF where the off-shore breeze keeps the air relatively clean.

What are all those shipping containers being offloaded from trains and onto trucks in Commerce? I wonder how much they account for the pollution.

Re: Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades

#63

Post by mrhappyunhappy »

I read somewhere that a single fire in the area pollutes more than all of th cars combined for a year. I don’t know how much of this is true, but if it is, it seems climate change is having a much bigger impact already that we simply choose to ignore.

Re: Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades

#64

Post by Retric »

mrhappyunhappy wrote: post #63

I read somewhere that a single fire in the area pollutes more than all of th cars combined for a year. I don’t know how much of this is true, but if it is, it seems climate change is having a much bigger impact already that we simply choose to ignore.

Winds blow east and most people live very close to the coast making fires significantly less of an issue. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:California_populatio... Big wildfires are also concentrated in areas with few people. https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?hl=en&mid=1ZpcZ8OMZh1G1...

The real issue is transportation pollution occurs right where people are. Further, you get inversion layers over cities which traps the pollution. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inversion_(meteorology)

Re: Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades

#65

Post by mrhappyunhappy »

When are we going to acknowledge that commuting to a city center in this day and age is a ridiculous thing to do. I would wager most of LAs output is in the form of info services that can be done from home or the burbs. I remember when gas prices were at an all time high at one point and nobody was dissuaded from driving less. People would simply complain more but suck it up and go about their routine anyway. And who can blame them?! SoCal is not traversable by any means other than an automobile. There are nutjobs who will fight tooth and nail about public transportation, specifically buses, but any resident will tell you what kind of people use those services and they can’t be convinced to. I reckon fires and geography have a lot to do with everything but unless there is a dramatic shift in public policy, ain’t nothing going to change.

Re: Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades

#66

Post by mrhappyunhappy »

Retric wrote: post #64
mrhappyunhappy wrote: post #63

I read somewhere that a single fire in the area pollutes more than all of th cars combined for a year. I don’t know how much of this is true, but if it is, it seems climate change is having a much bigger impact already that we simply choose to ignore.

Winds blow east and most people live very close to the coast making fires significantly less of an issue. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:California_populatio... Big wildfires are also concentrated in areas with few people. https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?hl=en&mid=1ZpcZ8OMZh1G1... The real issue is transportation pollution occurs right where people are. Further, you get inversion layers over cities whic…

Do you live in the area? It doesn’t sound like it. If you live anywhere near San Fernando valley then you’d be quick to acknowledge the impact fires have on the area.

Re: Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades

#68

Post by seanmcdirmid »

ptx wrote: post #57
gascan wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dang, would be nice if Android had more AQI built in. The 3rd party apps are not exactly rock solid.

My Huawei phone shows AQI in the weather app (don't know if it's Google's or Huawei's app) but only for some cities – it shows up for Beijing and Shanghai but not Paris or Athens.

AQI is essential to know in China, so the market adapts.

Re: Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades

#69

Post by saltcured »

Theodores wrote: post #18

Can anyone summarise the article for those of us in Europe? We can't get the LA Times here. What has changed this year - wild fires? Or is it the problem of ten million cars pissing in the pool with no wind to clear the air. Do tell.

I don't have hard data to back this up, but a number of my coworkers including a weekend sailor all feel that the general coastal climate and wind patterns have changed compared to what we remember from 20 years ago.

There seems to be much less of the strongly seasonal offshore flow (the Santa Ana winds) reaching us at the coast. This used to be a regular thing ramping up in the late summer and fall with huge wind gusts damaging local trees etc. Now, it seems like we hear about winds up in the mountains but they run out of energy (or lift above the surface?) before reaching the coast, while we can definitely feel the grit and see the brown, dirty layer of air extend out over the ocean.

Similarly, we have all commented on the disturbance in the strongly seasonal pattern of onshore flow (June Gloom). We remember more contrast between foggy mornings with the marine layer reaching many miles inland on some mornings but retreating and burning off, tending to blue skies in mid summer. In recent years, the marine layer seems to visit randomly throughout the year and it often seems to just park slightly off shore or mere blocks inland, with haze and humidity instead of sharp boundary between blue sky and fog.

In our coastal area between LAX and Santa Monica, we haven't had the obvious wildfire smoke impact that I saw during visits to the S.F. Bay Area this year.

Re: Southern California just saw its longest streak of bad air in decades

#70

Post by annywhey »

greglindahl wrote: post #49
refurb wrote: post #8

Los Angeles is unfortunate that due to the surrounding geography, thermal inversions are common where air close to the surface is trapped and doesn't circulate. That amplifies the air quality problems compared to say SF where the off-shore breeze keeps the air relatively clean.

In the SF Bay Area, there are a lot of parts (like the entire South Bay) that have frequent inversions and usually no off-shore breezes, due to the coastal mountains. In fact we've had a big run of bad air quality days. With a few of the recent fires to the north of SF we've also had the charming situation in the South Bay of ocean breezes blowing the smoke from the fires over us... it was blowing down the cost offsh…

We've had runs spanning a week plus this season where the AQI never gets under 50...SF is not really safe when it's wildfire smoke from the north because it ends up recirculating.

In fact we're in that kind of scenario right this minute.

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