Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Flutter Release Preview 2

developers.googleblog.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 123 posts

Re: Flutter Release Preview 2

#111

Post by RobertRoberts »

jrs95 wrote: post #55
RobertRoberts wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At one point there wasn't an alternative to Angular either, look what we have now. Not only that, there's still native. Which means anyone can easily hold out that is on the fence for who knows what comes in the future. Principles matter at some level, which is why many businesses abandoned Godaddy a few years back. But also there's simple budget considerations. Google has cost us tons of money over the years adjusti…

I'd argue people left GoDaddy because their services suck. At least, that's been my experience with them. And at the same time, what they were doing wasn't unique, you have nearly unlimited alternatives in that space. I hope you're right with the Angular comparison though, I would love to see other projects move in a direction that truly competes with what Flutter is doing. As for native...you're right, I'll continue…

A quick follow up, would this compete with Flutter? (just saw it linked on HN)

https://microsoft.github.io/reactxp/

Re: Flutter Release Preview 2

#112

Post by ozyx »

megaman821 wrote: post #7
joobus wrote: post #4

How confident can anyone be basing a core product on flutter given Google's history of abandonment?

I am especially nervous about Flutter since they don't even have to abandon it. If they don't keep pace with new OS releases, there is no great way to recoup your investment in Flutter. You are just stuck without an outdated looking app or forced to do a full rewrite in the native frameworks.

Keep in mind that Flutter is an open-source project with an active community. There's nothing particularly special about the built-in widgets that the Flutter framework provides; other developers can make and publish their own widgets easily enough if the built-in widgets are insufficient.

Re: Flutter Release Preview 2

#113

Post by Rubytron »

Nevercode is proud to join Flutter revolution! The day Flutter announces Release Preview 2 Nevercode CI/CD supports Flutter apps out-of-the-box. Building beautiful iOS & Android apps using a single code base just got better! Check our doc: https://developer.nevercode.io/docs/building-flutter-apps

Re: Flutter Release Preview 2

#114

Post by stewbrew »

sebe wrote: post #98
stewbrew wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, the argument basically boils down to: It's a bad thing to use a dsl or similar only for gui. It's a good thing to use a whole new language you have to port all your code to and that has only a small ecosystem so you can also write all these libraries yourself. Don't get me wrong. Flutter may well be a formidable piece of software. Dart either. I just don't get how flutter is marketed around the fact that dart was…

Hey I've been following Dartlang's up and downs over the years, here are some ramblings about Flutter. When the chrome guys started the Sky experiment, now the flutter project, they started with javascript. I don't know why they dropped javascript, but they looked at several languages before trying Dart. Here is a floss weekly episode with one of the co-founders, talks about flutter's hotreload, an idea that came fro…

Thanks for the background info. I was wrong then.

Re: Flutter Release Preview 2

#115

Post by jrs95 »

mixedCase wrote: post #104
jrs95 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The great development experience is largely tied into Dart and it's toolchain, not to mention all of the underlying Dart code in the project. However, you can get the same kind of control flow out of Dart albeit with a little less static checking ( https://github.com/dart-lang/sdk/issues/33079 ) so from a pragmatic standpoint this really shouldn't be something that's holding you back. The cost of not having ADTs is m…

Hi. Thanks for the workaround, it's fairly similar to how it's handled in TS, except more verbose (which TS is already very much so when compared to something like Elm). That isn't a problem for me since I have some experience with functional programming, but that'll likely be a serious disincentive for other devs (TS itself has been a problem already). Maybe I'm off the mark and that is idiomatic and a very common D…

Dart has had some null-aware operators for awhile (https://news.dartlang.org/2015/08/dart-112-released-with-nul...) otherwise you'll need to explicitly do null checks. It's certainly not perfect, but it's still "good enough" to make handling null relatively concise. In my experience code review can do a good enough job at promoting good practices around null handling that non-nullable types are really just a "nice to have".

Re: Flutter Release Preview 2

#116

Post by pjmlp »

danbalthasar wrote: post #109
pjmlp wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I rather use Qt and Xamarin for that purpose. More mature, may target desktop OSes and use languages that are actually relevant in the market during the last 20 years.

Flutter's edge over these technologies is faster development cycles (very fast build times, sub-second reloading without losing state, very rapid ability to update code/GUI after deployment to a testing device, and very fast render times). Xamarin and Qt are fine products, and I know Xamarin has been working on some improvements over deploy times, but it still can't touch what Flutter does there. And if you know C++…

A programming language is more than just semantics, Dart eco-system is a tiny dot when compared against C++ and C#.

Flutter deployment times aren't worthwhile enough to bother with a language with uncertain future.

Re: Flutter Release Preview 2

#117

Post by Apocryphon »

pjmlp wrote: post #116
danbalthasar wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Flutter's edge over these technologies is faster development cycles (very fast build times, sub-second reloading without losing state, very rapid ability to update code/GUI after deployment to a testing device, and very fast render times). Xamarin and Qt are fine products, and I know Xamarin has been working on some improvements over deploy times, but it still can't touch what Flutter does there. And if you know C++…

A programming language is more than just semantics, Dart eco-system is a tiny dot when compared against C++ and C#. Flutter deployment times aren't worthwhile enough to bother with a language with uncertain future.

Doesn't Dart interop with JavaScript libraries?

Re: Flutter Release Preview 2

#118

Post by malkia »

MarkMc wrote: post #110
malkia wrote: post #58

There is also an effort to bring flutter on the desktop. I dabbled (briefly) in it, got flutter app running on windows + linux, though certain integration factors (smooth window resizing, stability, mouse wheel support, etc.) were not there yet. For some of them (mouse wheel, keyboard, tabbing) there might be more work needed (and maybe not seen as important), but it could bring a real "electron" killer, where my sla…

I'm working on a project to get Flutter running on Mac and Windows: https://feather-apps.com There's also this project which uses Go to run Flutter on Windows and Linux: https://github.com/Drakirus/go-flutter-desktop-embedder Is your Windows implementation publicly available? I'd be curious to check it out.

I did some experimentation back in March, but it wasn't my work, I've found that Dwayne Slater (ds84182 on github) has made some modifications (with SDL) to get it through https://github.com/ds84182?utf8=&tab=repositories&q=flutter

I was able to get the gallery on, had to do some tweaks (like enforce binary mode when reading files, and certain other things, but haven't looked since then).

Re: Flutter Release Preview 2

#119

Post by malkia »

eseidelGoogle wrote: post #73
malkia wrote: post #58

There is also an effort to bring flutter on the desktop. I dabbled (briefly) in it, got flutter app running on windows + linux, though certain integration factors (smooth window resizing, stability, mouse wheel support, etc.) were not there yet. For some of them (mouse wheel, keyboard, tabbing) there might be more work needed (and maybe not seen as important), but it could bring a real "electron" killer, where my sla…

(Disclosure: I'm the Eng. Mgr for the Flutter project at Google.) I've seen Flutter run in lots of places, including desktops. Desktop isn't something my team is actively developing at this time (we're very focused on making mobile awesome), but we're definitely not stopping others from doing so. There is even another team at Google experimenting with the idea: https://github.com/google/flutter-desktop-embedding

Thank you so much for the work on the language/platform. I used to work for Google (LAX), and our team was using GWT, hopefully they have transitioned to Dart + Angular (by now). I fell in love with Flutter right away, but it was in no way connected to what I did back there.

Re: Flutter Release Preview 2

#120

Post by spiritcat »

Apocryphon wrote: post #89
spiritcat wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if the design choice made sense for [reasons], this is imo the biggest thing holding it back.

Having to learn a new programming language is hardly a rare experience in mobile development.

But when else are you ever going to use dart?
Post reply on HN