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Apple, Firefox tools aim to thwart Facebook, Google tracking

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Re: Apple, Firefox tools aim to thwart Facebook, Google tracking

#91

Post by cecja »

e_modad wrote: post #82
ultimoo wrote: post #60

> To get the protections, you’ll have to break your habit of using Google’s Chrome browser, which by some estimates has more than half of the worldwide browser usage. Safari and Firefox have less than 20 percent combined. This point is key here. I switched to FF about 6 months ago and every time I'm showing something to co-workers they will usually remark how unusual it is that I'm not using Chrome. Chrome is the de…

I always thought of Opera as the quintessential engineer's browser. I switched away from Chrome a couple years ago and haven't looked back since. It's fast, has tons of extensions and works well for pretty much everything.

If you started using it in 2016 you are basically using chrome. Before it had its own rendering and js engines and wouldn't really be useful for engineers working with web technologies. That a side it is now owned by a Chinese consortium with some bad reputation.

Re: Apple, Firefox tools aim to thwart Facebook, Google tracking

#92

Post by ionised »

ultimoo wrote: post #60

> To get the protections, you’ll have to break your habit of using Google’s Chrome browser, which by some estimates has more than half of the worldwide browser usage. Safari and Firefox have less than 20 percent combined. This point is key here. I switched to FF about 6 months ago and every time I'm showing something to co-workers they will usually remark how unusual it is that I'm not using Chrome. Chrome is the de…

Can't say as a developer I've ever felt crippled using Firefox over Chrome.

Re: Apple, Firefox tools aim to thwart Facebook, Google tracking

#93

Post by [deleted] »

ma2rten wrote: post #71
Raphmedia wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox (and Firebug) used to be THE environment used to develop for the web. Things changed and will change again. Chrome isn't some magic immortal browser.

People used to think that Chrome will never take over IE on Windows. Most people will just keep using the default browser. I think that was valid. I don't really understand how Google managed to get people to switch. Is it just ads on google.com?

[deleted]

Re: Apple, Firefox tools aim to thwart Facebook, Google tracking

#94

Post by JoshMnem »

bogomipz wrote: post #80
JoshMnem wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google also built Chrome to send people to Google Search and click on ads on the way to their destinations. That's why auto-completion in Chrome is terrible. You will often end up on Google Search rather than the destination site. The ads are now disguised so well that most people probably click on them without realizing that they are ads. Unfortunately, Firefox is now making a mistake by copying Chrome and mixing se…

>"That's why auto-completion in Chrome is terrible. You will often end up on Google Search rather than the destination site." Interesting I have noticed this lately as well. Really bad one character a second latency. This is recent-ish phenomenon no? I don't remember this ever being an issue before. >"Unfortunately, Firefox is now making a mistake by copying Chrome and mixing search results with URLs in one box" I co…

It has been like that as long as I can remember. I couldn't understand why people were falling for the "Chrome is faster" line when it was wasting everyone's time by sending people to search results instead of URLs like Firefox.

Google Chrome doesn't really let you set a home page other than a Google Search box. Even if you set your home page to a specific URL, opening a new tab doesn't start you on your home page -- you get a Google Search box.

Google's attempt to remove subdomains and hide URLs from users also appears to be part of a plan to force users to become more dependent on search rather than being able to go directly to destinations.

Chrome is full of manipulative patterns.

Re: Apple, Firefox tools aim to thwart Facebook, Google tracking

#95

Post by capsule_toy »

ma2rten wrote: post #71
Raphmedia wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox (and Firebug) used to be THE environment used to develop for the web. Things changed and will change again. Chrome isn't some magic immortal browser.

People used to think that Chrome will never take over IE on Windows. Most people will just keep using the default browser. I think that was valid. I don't really understand how Google managed to get people to switch. Is it just ads on google.com?

I want to say that developers and smaller Saas companies might have played a role in this. Smaller businesses are not as big on ensuring everything works across browsers. Most developers use Chrome, so the likelihood of an issue popping up in Chrome is less than other browsers. When an issue does come up with someone using IE and the customer just wants it to work, the easiest solution is to just get them to download Chrome. Many of these customers don't really care what browser they're using and will gladly listen to whatever instructions customer support tells them.

Re: Apple, Firefox tools aim to thwart Facebook, Google tracking

#96

Post by hrktb »

bogomipz wrote: post #85
hrktb wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox has. It screws third party logins and integration (mainly google/facebook logins) and Google’s captchas, which will be way harder than when cookies are shared.

>"It screws third party logins and integration (mainly google/facebook logins) and Google’s captchas, which will be way harder than when cookies are shared." Could you elaborate on this? Whats the connection between shared cookies and Google's captcha intenstity? Thanks.

There was this post a discussed here a few weeks ago: https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/firefox-fpi

In short, Google uses part of its behavioral data to decide beforehand how much of a captcha is needed. With no data at all you get the full blown one.

Re: Apple, Firefox tools aim to thwart Facebook, Google tracking

#97

Post by greendestiny_re »

These efforts are commendable but the UI developed around them, particularly the "don't allow/allow", is atrocious and a pale memory of Firefox philosophy of placing control into user's hands. Where is the additional information? Where are the choices? How is the user being tracked? Will the user have to constantly dismiss these dialog boxes?

I started using FF in 2005 exactly because I felt it gave me a way to peek under the hood and customize my browsing experience. For the first time ever the software I was using was truly mine and it empowered me. I even got interested in programming because I was, for example, learning how to write and edit Adblock filters to nix that one persistent page element or using developer tools to sift through page code and extract Instagram images of bikini models. This would never have happened had my curiosity not been piqued by the notion of software made to serve _me_.

Is this how Firefox is going to be from now on? Incessant dialog boxes?

Re: Apple, Firefox tools aim to thwart Facebook, Google tracking

#98

Post by fukuwata »

greendestiny_re wrote: post #97

These efforts are commendable but the UI developed around them, particularly the "don't allow/allow", is atrocious and a pale memory of Firefox philosophy of placing control into user's hands. Where is the additional information? Where are the choices? How is the user being tracked? Will the user have to constantly dismiss these dialog boxes? I started using FF in 2005 exactly because I felt it gave me a way to peek…

> using developer tools to sift through page code and extract Instagram images of bikini models

why were you doing such a sexist thing?

Re: Apple, Firefox tools aim to thwart Facebook, Google tracking

#99

Post by bogomipz »

hrktb wrote: post #96
bogomipz wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"It screws third party logins and integration (mainly google/facebook logins) and Google’s captchas, which will be way harder than when cookies are shared." Could you elaborate on this? Whats the connection between shared cookies and Google's captcha intenstity? Thanks.

There was this post a discussed here a few weeks ago: https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/firefox-fpi In short, Google uses part of its behavioral data to decide beforehand how much of a captcha is needed. With no data at all you get the full blown one.

Wow, from your link:

>"As I noted only recently, Google reCAPTCHA has a 99,3 % global marketshare in CAPTCHA services.

No CAPTCHA reCAPTCHA uses Google’s knowledge and insights about you from tracking you around the web to determine whether you’re a computer or a human; instead of asking you to pass a cognitive tests. Google seem to have reduced confidence in their ability to identify you as a human with reduced tracking and an unusual number of unique users (every website is assigned different tracking/user ID/user instead of sharing the same ID) from your IP address."

Google has literally become a gatekeeper for substantial part of the web. I had not seen that statistic before. I'm surprised this particular point is not discussed more. More recently I have just stopped using captchas when possible. I just won't sign up for the service. I'm not sure how else to fight this. The idea that you should penalized for trying to protect your privacy is truly reprehensible.

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