In the future, you will go out with your keyboard instead of a laptop.
I'm waiting for the day I can just carry my phone, a small keyboard, and some (relatively) small VR glasses.
Ask HN: Best robust laptop for everyday software development
61–70 of 100 posts
Re: Ask HN: Best robust laptop for everyday software development
#62I used my T61 for 6 years and had to give it up because the graphic chip busted. Since then I have used multiple laptops Dell to Apple. I even installed Ubuntu on my Apple mac Pro, but it would not suspend and heat up inside my laptop bag.. finally shit blew up.
I have been using Xiaomi notebook pro for the last 8 months. Even with a hefty customs, it was cheaper by 80% for any laptop of the same configuration. The build quality feels like Macbook Pro. Ubuntu works out of box.. It suspends and everything works except the fingerprint reader.
The xiaomi notebook pro is as heavy as high end macbook Pro and the build quality is brilliant! The config is crazy and haven't faced a problem yet.
I check the quality of a good laptop by the how much the lid oscillates if you chuck it a little. Macbook Pro and xiaomi don't oscillate at all.. Dell, compaq, Asus oscillate a good 10-20 degrees.
Re: Ask HN: Best robust laptop for everyday software development
#63As much as I like to bang on Apple for various and sundry reasons I go back to Apple every time because I can walk into any apple store in the world and I can get the thing serviced on the spot, often for free, but as a dev, time is money and I need something sorted right away. This is what you're paying extra for when you buy a mac. Make no mistake.
my mbp (late 2016) is currently out for a keyboard replacement because keys kept falling off. i'll be waiting 5-7 days (currently at 5), but it took weeks to make an appointment... even reaching them by phone is hard.
this made me wonder if one can pay to get faster service from apple.
this is in amsterdam (NL). btw, once you get through, they are helpful and the experience is positive. i suppose they haven't scaled support with their sales/problems.
work continues with an x220 (i forgot what a good keyboard feels like!).
Re: Ask HN: Best robust laptop for everyday software development
#64Thinkpad Carbon X1 6th gen w/ Ubuntu. IR camera is useless but whatever
So is the finger print reader. The IR works nicely in dim lit rooms
Re: Ask HN: Best robust laptop for everyday software development
#65As much as I like to bang on Apple for various and sundry reasons I go back to Apple every time because I can walk into any apple store in the world and I can get the thing serviced on the spot, often for free, but as a dev, time is money and I need something sorted right away. This is what you're paying extra for when you buy a mac. Make no mistake.
Yup. Even with Apple's issues with their keyboard, I still bought the latest Macbook Pro. Just got AppleCare+ to go with it.
Re: Ask HN: Best robust laptop for everyday software development
#66> I'm owning a X1 Carbon
Just curious, what generation X1? Gen3s through gen5s in our fleet have been quite robust, but Gen6 have been problematic from the linux support side. We have a couple of problematic individual X1 laptops in the fleet that have been in for service multiple times, but knowing the owners of the laptops in question, it is not surprising.
We've got between 40-60 X1s (gens 3-5) and I'd say their issue rate is at or below that of our fleet of 200+ 13" MBPs. In that time, we've had one X1 with a broken hinge, one with a dead fan, and one with chronic user issues :)
The new 13" MBPs have been particularly bad with chronic keyboard, battery and screen issues. So much so that people with the old MBPs are holding off to the very last minute to update. Which sucks because in most cases, their problems with them would be fixed by new batteries and an OS reinstall, but since they're not serviceable, we just bin them for a 3rd party service provider to deal with later.
Also, the fact that Apple refuses to provide any type of pickup or onsite service contract is absolutely ridiculous. The damn things fail so frequently, it's cheaper for us to overstock Mac laptops just because it can take weeks to get a laptop fixed even through our 3rd party service provider. Our service provider often cannot get parts or has to wait for Apple to approve the release of a part to them even though they're an Apple certified shop.
Even going to the Apple Store is a complete and utter yardsale in our experience. Most of the time, it'll take them a week or more to fix anything, usually they say, because of parts availability (we're talking 13" MBP and 13" MBA mostly).
Re: Ask HN: Best robust laptop for everyday software development
#67I have owned Thinkpads since IBM days, testing the waters occasionally outside of the brand. My proposition is also a bit easier since I will only ever use Linux or FreeBSD (and never Windows or Mac). I stand by the W530, the P50, and most recently, the P52. I felt so strongly about my initial impression of the P52 that I bought one for myself to use for all of my personal work. Perhaps it's just a thing with the X1 Carbon?
That being said, my personally-owned P52 is the first Thinkpad I've ever had that required me to re-paste the chips. For the benefit of readers, Thinkpads have a not insignificant chance (~5-10%?) you'll need to re-paste the thermal paste on the CPU and/or GPU, and this is the first one I've ever had that needed the re-paste. I have always re-pasted the chips perhaps the last ten years or so -- doing this while changing out the components (usually RAM and disk) with top-of-the-line components I buy separately because they're oftentimes hundreds of dollars cheaper if you install them yourself -- but didn't need to re-paste until this one, which would immediately throttle out under any kind of load.
One more complaint: I wanted a P52 with a 4K display, but Lenovo refuses to sell a configuration with a 4K display that does not have that awful, terrible, shitty fingerprint-magnet glossy TOUCH screen. There is no way in hell I would use that glossy screen or a touch screen of any kind on my daily driver, so I was forced to stick with a "regular" HD display. In hindsight, I'm actually happier not having spent the money on something that I don't typically use (as I am far more likely to use workspace-switching hotkeys than try to make my use of screen real estate more efficient). Anyway, I agree that Lenovo is starting to cut corners, and it seems that eventually (perhaps soon) Thinkpads will no longer be suitable in this role. But today, with my recent history with the W530, P50, and P52, I still stand by Thinkpad as my rugged daily driver and constant life companion.
Re: Ask HN: Best robust laptop for everyday software development
#68If you want something dirt-cheap and easy to repair, go with one of the earlier thinkpad x-series, x200, x201, x220, x230... They're underpowered, but if you're just SSHing into a remote box it's a good choice.
> They're underpowered, but if you're just SSHing into a remote box it's a good choice.
I feel like this concept doesn't get enough attention. You'll never get a laptop (that you actually want to carry) that has as much power as a server in a rack somewhere. Thinking of the laptop as an ephemeral mobile thin client rather than an entire workstation lets you focus on finding a laptop that's comfortable to type on and not a pain to carry. Trying to combine all of those requirements with a lot of computing power is much more difficult and expensive.
I second the earlier thinkpad X series suggestion. My x201 was less than $200, has fantastic driver support, and you can beat the snot out of them. https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=thinkpad+x201+c...
Re: Ask HN: Best robust laptop for everyday software development
#69The X220/30 is still a very viable Dev machine if you don't mind the screen. As a word of caution, I went down the MBP route myself and was recently caught with the dust under the keyboard membrane problem. You probably aren't accurately evaluating how annoying it is to randomly lose your laptop for a few weeks while they repair the keyboard. I certainly was not.
Compressed air duster didn't fix it?
I have a 2016 Macbook Pro 15" that had the keyboard issue. When it occurred, the problem was not as well known about.
It did not feel like a problem caused by dust. Perhaps it was due to the small tolerances in the keyboard mechanism.
The B key would only work with a very firm press.
Because the laptop was fairly new, I assumed the problem was caused by a manufacturing defect with the frame. The problem was typically worse when the laptop was cold vs. hot.
If the problem is caused by dust (which I find hard to believe due to my issue after only 4 months of ownership) the problem must only need a small obstruction in the right place to cause a key to fail.
When the key failure happens, duster does not seem to help at all.
After the replacement, I have had no other failures. It's sad that a wonderful machine can be brought down with this terrible issue.
On a side note, I am very happy with the computer overall. The four thunderbolt 3 ports allow me to run my entire setup over one connection. I run an external RX 580 in an Akitio Node Pro to 2 4k monitors. MacOS UI design in my opinion feels clean compared to Windows currently and application support is fantastic compared to ten years ago!
Just thought I would offer my insight :)
Re: Ask HN: Best robust laptop for everyday software development
#70I'm a huge fan of the Asus Zenbooks for taking it with me. Also, the Sagers for powerful computing. (But it's not as portable). Sagers are gaming laptops. All of the machines have Linux. The HP Workbooks/zbooks have been decent for work.
I own Asus Zenbook for about 6 months and I'm disappointed with the problems it has on Linux. At least with Ubuntu 16 here are things that don't work out of a box (I didn't try Ubuntu 17 or 18, but based on my readings 17 has similar problems):
* Dual GPU support, several configurations that I've tried cause the system to hang. For now I'm using nvidia all the time, which drains the battery.
* Special keys for things like brightness and sound level do not work.
* Every couple of restarts the sound is broken (unbearable noise while playing).
I'm sure all this issues are fixable with enough time, which unfortunately I don't have (this is not my main development machine, I still use desktop for most of the work). I was just surprised that in 2018 a shinny laptop can work so poorly with Linux.